Have to agree with you Yummymunchies
SoE’s MMORPG marketing dept. is nonexistent.
They need to Hire WoW's marketing team.
Or spread vicious rumors like Megan Fox has a toon on Zek /wink
WoW has Ozzy, and we all know he can not punch his way out of a wet paper bag let alone type on a keyboard.
Get your friends to start up a toon. EQ started by word of mouth. And we all know SoE will not do crap to advertise. In fact I think they work on diminishing the existing population.
Edited, Sep 14th 2009 11:58am by Vinney
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Server PopulationsFollow
Come visit my housing creations 20+ in Cedar Country Meadows, ZEK.
36 posts
Im seeing a few problems right now with the server populations and lack of groups.
1. Im wondering how much of lack of groups is due to class issues? In groups is there a real difference between a berserker rogue ranger or mage? dps is dps and the pure dps classes offer nothing else to a group. Too many people seem to want to play the flashy dps classes which is fine. However then your competing with 3/4 the server for a group. not sure really how to resolve this problem though but i think its an issue.
2. I understand that boxing was a reaction to lack of groups but now its become a staple and its a no win situation. People complain people box too much therefore the lack of groups. On the other hand people complain about no groups so they have to box which kills grouping in general. I think a server merge would help this a bit. But inviting more people to box i think is just going to push people away more.
3. Ive read on a few occasions people suggest join a guild and level. One thats no easy task. Two guilds atleast the ones ive been in tend to be very clique. If your not in that clique or play a must have class so to speak you dont get groups either. On Quellious We've got a few main raid guilds. The hardcore raid guild (CV), 2 2guild alliances (EIE/DA, VINC/BM), and a 3 guild alliance(W/R/R), plus others. Sorry if i forgot other guilds those are just the main ones i see as prim raiding guilds. Id vote for the merger alone for another good guild to come in for more options. (never been a fan of guild alliances)
4. I think the new mms killed grouping some too. Yea there are long recast timers but once someones done with them on their main the switch to their alt and do them again. Therefore people are just constantly doing mms and thats killing the already lack of groups too.
5. Why is WOW so sucessfull? Ive never done much but fiddle with it on a friends account and wasnt too impressed by it. The graphics were cartoony. But people love playing it? They keep people from leaving so how are they doing it? Whats the appeal about wow? Im not saying make eq wow but theyre obviously doing something right.
Sorry i know this became a fix eq post and a bit off topic and i apologize. These are just my observations. Overall im infavor of a new merger. It would bring more guilds and more people to the servers and give more chances for people to group. I dont think overcrowding would effect the servers much like leerah said theres still no people there now. ive been grinding a twink the last 3 weeks using the hotzones before the patch. I saw no one in ef perma or iceclad. i was by myself most of the time in tofs with a one or two other people poping in every so often. Granted the old hz were kinda crappy and the new ones better but still. I dont see eq getting any better though unless u advertise or overhaul your game. Its just going to dwindle and die and i hate to see that happen.
1. Im wondering how much of lack of groups is due to class issues? In groups is there a real difference between a berserker rogue ranger or mage? dps is dps and the pure dps classes offer nothing else to a group. Too many people seem to want to play the flashy dps classes which is fine. However then your competing with 3/4 the server for a group. not sure really how to resolve this problem though but i think its an issue.
2. I understand that boxing was a reaction to lack of groups but now its become a staple and its a no win situation. People complain people box too much therefore the lack of groups. On the other hand people complain about no groups so they have to box which kills grouping in general. I think a server merge would help this a bit. But inviting more people to box i think is just going to push people away more.
3. Ive read on a few occasions people suggest join a guild and level. One thats no easy task. Two guilds atleast the ones ive been in tend to be very clique. If your not in that clique or play a must have class so to speak you dont get groups either. On Quellious We've got a few main raid guilds. The hardcore raid guild (CV), 2 2guild alliances (EIE/DA, VINC/BM), and a 3 guild alliance(W/R/R), plus others. Sorry if i forgot other guilds those are just the main ones i see as prim raiding guilds. Id vote for the merger alone for another good guild to come in for more options. (never been a fan of guild alliances)
4. I think the new mms killed grouping some too. Yea there are long recast timers but once someones done with them on their main the switch to their alt and do them again. Therefore people are just constantly doing mms and thats killing the already lack of groups too.
5. Why is WOW so sucessfull? Ive never done much but fiddle with it on a friends account and wasnt too impressed by it. The graphics were cartoony. But people love playing it? They keep people from leaving so how are they doing it? Whats the appeal about wow? Im not saying make eq wow but theyre obviously doing something right.
Sorry i know this became a fix eq post and a bit off topic and i apologize. These are just my observations. Overall im infavor of a new merger. It would bring more guilds and more people to the servers and give more chances for people to group. I dont think overcrowding would effect the servers much like leerah said theres still no people there now. ive been grinding a twink the last 3 weeks using the hotzones before the patch. I saw no one in ef perma or iceclad. i was by myself most of the time in tofs with a one or two other people poping in every so often. Granted the old hz were kinda crappy and the new ones better but still. I dont see eq getting any better though unless u advertise or overhaul your game. Its just going to dwindle and die and i hate to see that happen.
IronHaloLP wrote:
5. Why is WOW so sucessfull? Ive never done much but fiddle with it on a friends account and wasnt too impressed by it. The graphics were cartoony. But people love playing it? They keep people from leaving so how are they doing it? Whats the appeal about wow? Im not saying make eq wow but theyre obviously doing something right.
They realized that making the game casual and fun was a better draw than making it "hard core!". Which made it more attractive to get into for newer players who may have heard EQ's reputation as a grindfest that required 12 hour camps and tons of commitment (remember guild phone trees so they could wake you up at 3am for a Ragefire kill?) to reach the top in. It also helped it appeal to previous EQ players who were in college in 1999 and had 10 hours to blow in LGuk trying to get a FBSS but were now homeowners with real jobs and spouses and stuff and who wanted to see advancement in an hour's time, not ten hour's time. Because it was more casual and got rid of a lot of not-very-fun stuff, it gained a better reputation and more people joined and it became the game to joni if you wanted to be part of the most popular MMORPG.
I personally liked EQ more and played EQ for around ten years (and played WoW for maybe six months) but there's not much secret to how WoW won the fight.
Oh, as for the WoW graphics, they serve a purpose in that Blizzard isn't (A) obligated to try to make everything photorealistic and failing at it and (B) makes the game accessible to low end systems because of (A). they never bothered me much because it's a consistent theme throughout the game which is more than you can say for the EQ mash-up of old world, Kunark/Velious era, Luclin era and beyond graphics.
Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
Jophiel wrote:
They realized that making the game casual and fun was a better draw than making it "hard core!". Which made it more attractive to get into for newer players who may have heard EQ's reputation as a grindfest that required 12 hour camps and tons of commitment (remember guild phone trees so they could wake you up at 3am for a Ragefire kill?) to reach the top in. It also helped it appeal to previous EQ players who were in college in 1999 and had 10 hours to blow in LGuk trying to get a FBSS but were now homeowners with real jobs and spouses and stuff and who wanted to see advancement in an hour's time, not ten hour's time. Because it was more casual and got rid of a lot of not-very-fun stuff, it gained a better reputation and more people joined and it became the game to joni if you wanted to be part of the most popular MMORPG.
I personally liked EQ more and played EQ for around ten years (and played WoW for maybe six months) but there's not much secret to how WoW won the fight.
Oh, as for the WoW graphics, they serve a purpose in that Blizzard isn't (A) obligated to try to make everything photorealistic and failing at it and (B) makes the game accessible to low end systems because of (A). they never bothered me much because it's a consistent theme throughout the game which is more than you can say for the EQ mash-up of old world, Kunark/Velious era, Luclin era and beyond graphics.
Jophiel nailed it above.
--------
IronHaloLP: EQ seems dead from the fact that a large part of the population either quit, logs in a few times a week to raid and otherwise plays other games, or is casually spread out in a massive world /anon with tons of instances that make you think no one is in the area.
Hang around in The Overthere for an afternoon hitting /who every 5 minutes... you will have lots of traffic going by and never see most of them. They are going places and not after the sarnaks of course.
I only agree with Jophiel to a certain extent. All the reasons mention are valid and true, but the amount of time spent in front of your computer is fixed for both. If you have an hour to devote to gaming be it with EQ or WoW an hour is an hour. Big question is, as a marketing firm, is how you get the consumer to spend their hour on your game. WoW seemed to be more aggressive in their marketing campaigned then EQ and they continue to do so. When you walk into Wal-Mart and walk past the poster in the entrance with the stating date of a new WoW’s expansion that was bought. When you go into Game Stop and trip over the floor display stacking WoW’s new expansion. That has been negotiated and paid for. When you read an article regarding an event in a gaming magazine again that article was negotiated for.
Tell me how a new player, who has never played a MMORPG game, knows about EverQuest? That inquiring mind is watching TV and notices a WoW commercial may has a new PC or lap top and these commercials peek their interest in these sorts of games. The questioning player is not going to be able to go to a game shop and find EQ on the shelf. But will have a huge selection of games, expansions and guide books on WoW.
My 16 year old plays WoW. He admits that EQ is a much more complex game. Is more interesting and enjoys playing but and a big BUT his friends play WoW and once you start a game and have invested an amount of time it is hard to switch. So he rather play and communicate with his friends both on and off game then try to convert them to a game they never heard of.
I am not one just to ***** and not have solutions.
I think if SoE puts out a game disk, with 15days or 1 month trial, but full game on a store counter display. Charge a dollar for it, but give it to a store or chain, so that way the proprietor has a chance to make a “FREE BUCKâ€. Make the packaging attractive enough so the person picks it up and looks at it… crap a blank disk cover with the word just $1 would do it. Let the game speak for itself and hopefully the veteran players realize how a new player is healthy for the continuation of their game and help them as much as possible.
Another idea, this is a self interest thing for myself because of my situation of playing a lot in “AFK†because of work, is to make the Bazaar common ground to all servers except Firiona Vie because of their no drop policy. I believe there is no finer tool to a “Free Market†experience then EQ Bazaar. Then give this disk to High School economic classes so the students could experience just the Bazaar. When you zone out you zone back into your own server. The students would not be able to zone. Make sure their program has all the “Bad Word†filters and let them negotiate with players to farm products for them or buy cheap and sell higher in bazaar and learn. In turn we have a bunch of young players exposed to game and if we get just 1% to continue to play would improve population tremendously besides would bring back the “Word of Mouth†advertisement that this game built itself on. This disk would also be a tax write off for SoE.
There are tons more ideas like incentives to bring new players in. More hands on game experience by GM’s etc…
Good thread here is: https://everquest.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=1&mid=1228771497304713574&page=1
In my opinion SoE dropped the ball in marketing. They game is great. There is a constant growing number of NEW players growing up and populating the net. SoE just needs to get a share of the market. They NEED to MARKET the game. At least make it available to the consumer then hopping that the population logs onto http://www.station.sony.com/en/freeTrials.vm
Edited, Oct 10th 2009 5:10am by Vinney
Tell me how a new player, who has never played a MMORPG game, knows about EverQuest? That inquiring mind is watching TV and notices a WoW commercial may has a new PC or lap top and these commercials peek their interest in these sorts of games. The questioning player is not going to be able to go to a game shop and find EQ on the shelf. But will have a huge selection of games, expansions and guide books on WoW.
My 16 year old plays WoW. He admits that EQ is a much more complex game. Is more interesting and enjoys playing but and a big BUT his friends play WoW and once you start a game and have invested an amount of time it is hard to switch. So he rather play and communicate with his friends both on and off game then try to convert them to a game they never heard of.
I am not one just to ***** and not have solutions.
I think if SoE puts out a game disk, with 15days or 1 month trial, but full game on a store counter display. Charge a dollar for it, but give it to a store or chain, so that way the proprietor has a chance to make a “FREE BUCKâ€. Make the packaging attractive enough so the person picks it up and looks at it… crap a blank disk cover with the word just $1 would do it. Let the game speak for itself and hopefully the veteran players realize how a new player is healthy for the continuation of their game and help them as much as possible.
Another idea, this is a self interest thing for myself because of my situation of playing a lot in “AFK†because of work, is to make the Bazaar common ground to all servers except Firiona Vie because of their no drop policy. I believe there is no finer tool to a “Free Market†experience then EQ Bazaar. Then give this disk to High School economic classes so the students could experience just the Bazaar. When you zone out you zone back into your own server. The students would not be able to zone. Make sure their program has all the “Bad Word†filters and let them negotiate with players to farm products for them or buy cheap and sell higher in bazaar and learn. In turn we have a bunch of young players exposed to game and if we get just 1% to continue to play would improve population tremendously besides would bring back the “Word of Mouth†advertisement that this game built itself on. This disk would also be a tax write off for SoE.
There are tons more ideas like incentives to bring new players in. More hands on game experience by GM’s etc…
Good thread here is: https://everquest.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=1&mid=1228771497304713574&page=1
In my opinion SoE dropped the ball in marketing. They game is great. There is a constant growing number of NEW players growing up and populating the net. SoE just needs to get a share of the market. They NEED to MARKET the game. At least make it available to the consumer then hopping that the population logs onto http://www.station.sony.com/en/freeTrials.vm
Edited, Oct 10th 2009 5:10am by Vinney
Come visit my housing creations 20+ in Cedar Country Meadows, ZEK.
I'm begining to side with you people who think marketing is part of the answer. I just asked an Aussie guildy who has been with me since the Cold Fury days (and claims to hate computers) how he got started in EQ. He told me that it was a free CD included on a cereal box or something. (Don't quote me on where the CD came from but it was definitely free and direct.)
I keep meaning to write an article on EQ and virtual life for the AARP magazine but never get around to it. If you are over 48 and you play regularly, send your story to me at Clearleechatter@yahoo.com
Lee of Quellious
I keep meaning to write an article on EQ and virtual life for the AARP magazine but never get around to it. If you are over 48 and you play regularly, send your story to me at Clearleechatter@yahoo.com
Lee of Quellious
Fight smarter not harder.
There has ALREADY been server merges in the past. How is that a solution ?
You can merge some servers AGAIN, but then what happens when the population of those servers go down ? Cry for ANOTHER server merge ?
If the population is descending, it's obviously because people are leaving the either the game or the server. I have friends who were in major power guilds and a those guilds are slowly dissolving because of players not being on so much anymore or just not playing anymore.
I agree, Everquest has to be marketed on the outside a lot more, but it also has to work on the content to keep players.
But we all know the advantages and disadvantages that the addition of the mercenaries caused for grouping or "finding a group"
I constantly get people asking me to invite them to a group and I have to turn them down, because I "4-box" with 2 mercs, so I never need anyone, but
at the same time, I am a happy camper, because those days of sitting around
"LFG" are a thing of the past .....
The population on my server is of no interest to me. I don't see a problem
with it, because I still see those infamous ooc's "camp check" a LOT.
It's annoying when you constantly have to protect your camp from a lot of
players, so I don't know WHY the population would be a concern for anyone!!
You can merge some servers AGAIN, but then what happens when the population of those servers go down ? Cry for ANOTHER server merge ?
If the population is descending, it's obviously because people are leaving the either the game or the server. I have friends who were in major power guilds and a those guilds are slowly dissolving because of players not being on so much anymore or just not playing anymore.
I agree, Everquest has to be marketed on the outside a lot more, but it also has to work on the content to keep players.
But we all know the advantages and disadvantages that the addition of the mercenaries caused for grouping or "finding a group"
I constantly get people asking me to invite them to a group and I have to turn them down, because I "4-box" with 2 mercs, so I never need anyone, but
at the same time, I am a happy camper, because those days of sitting around
"LFG" are a thing of the past .....
The population on my server is of no interest to me. I don't see a problem
with it, because I still see those infamous ooc's "camp check" a LOT.
It's annoying when you constantly have to protect your camp from a lot of
players, so I don't know WHY the population would be a concern for anyone!!
The last mergers were almost 2 yrs before WOW came out!
Fight smarter not harder.
UnholyCzars wrote:
The last mergers were almost 2 yrs before WOW came out!
Are you sure?
Maybe my memory is foggy, but I seem to recall Rodcet Nife server losing alot of people from some very good guilds to WoW Beta and they stayed with WoW launch. The way GoD launcged didn't help matters at the time either.
Again, perhaps I am foggy, but Rodcet merged with Quellious after OoW no?
Perhaps someone else can verify --I truly am uncertain on the exact timeline.
---
Last report I heard was that Soe's in-game metrics basically told them server load was healthy at peak times to the point that mergers were undesirable. Maybe this is false --but I find it believable. I know of some pretty large groups that login to do their scheduled raiding and play other games the rest of the time.
If a particular server is truly dying then it should be given free moves off to share the population out, and then merge the indecisive/inactives all to the next weakest server -assuming that just plain merging it would overwhelm any destination server at peak times.
No, the merges were in 2004. I know because I had just joined with Aude Sapere on Morden Rasp when we were merged with Povar. I just did a forum search to see when I started talking about Aude Sapere and it was 2004.
People talking about WoW's marketing need to understand that Blizzard can get TV commercials and leverage gant floor displays and get product placement because the game has 12,000,000+ subscribers and makes a bajillion dollars every month. EQ has, maybe, 100,000 subscribers. Subtract the cost of the employees, servers, etc etc and SOE isn't going to be making TV commercials or leveraging huge floor displays with Gamestop any time soon.
Edited: Whoops! I said 2007 which should have been 2004. Still, 2004 was when WoW came out and the merges were in eventual response to that. They weren't two years prior to WoW's launch.
Edited, Oct 12th 2009 7:29pm by Jophiel
People talking about WoW's marketing need to understand that Blizzard can get TV commercials and leverage gant floor displays and get product placement because the game has 12,000,000+ subscribers and makes a bajillion dollars every month. EQ has, maybe, 100,000 subscribers. Subtract the cost of the employees, servers, etc etc and SOE isn't going to be making TV commercials or leveraging huge floor displays with Gamestop any time soon.
Edited: Whoops! I said 2007 which should have been 2004. Still, 2004 was when WoW came out and the merges were in eventual response to that. They weren't two years prior to WoW's launch.
Edited, Oct 12th 2009 7:29pm by Jophiel
Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
Jophiel, lack of money or players is not an excuse. EQ at one time was the leading Game with a lot more than 100k players. WoW started at zero after EQ had their population and established the standard. MARKETTING on WoW’s part did it, and the lack of SoE following suit. As money goes I would take Sony’s bottom line over Blizzards any day.
If I remember correctly EQ was once the world’s 5th largest economy. That is big. With their subscriptions, items being sold on line, accounts trader or bought and side companies built because of the game. I think this site was built that way.
In my opinion, SoE going to an on line expansions and game purchase only had hurt it more than they think. Removing game disk from store shelves and hoping the new consumer would log on their site was not a well thought out move. I am not asking for them to match Obama’s campaigns cost. Just a disk on a store counter would work. Get the Name and the Game out in public. This game started by world of mouth but can not continue this way unless there is outside excitement added to it. WoW does that. Kids talk about wow in school or at home. Crap we are talking about it. The old phrase “I don’t care how my name was mention, just spell it correctly†is a strong statement. People don’t talk about EQ besides in game any more. When EQ first started it was on the 6:00 news and wrote about in all the gaming magazines. The other statement “You have to spend money to make money†is very important in the business world and on a MMORPG population is money. In the fast paced computer world it will take more than just word of mouth anymore. You have to market product.
Speaking about fast pasted. I personally finally broke down, got rid of my Pentium 3, 2.5ram, 9600 radon video card & 19in tube monitor. Bought a quad, 4gig ram, 1gig Nvida card, & 23†LCD and what a difference. Detail in graphics, movement, content & game play in my opinion still beat wow hands down. The thing that makes wow is, if you trip on it long enough you will pick it up….SoE, make EQ a house old name AGAIN.
If I remember correctly EQ was once the world’s 5th largest economy. That is big. With their subscriptions, items being sold on line, accounts trader or bought and side companies built because of the game. I think this site was built that way.
In my opinion, SoE going to an on line expansions and game purchase only had hurt it more than they think. Removing game disk from store shelves and hoping the new consumer would log on their site was not a well thought out move. I am not asking for them to match Obama’s campaigns cost. Just a disk on a store counter would work. Get the Name and the Game out in public. This game started by world of mouth but can not continue this way unless there is outside excitement added to it. WoW does that. Kids talk about wow in school or at home. Crap we are talking about it. The old phrase “I don’t care how my name was mention, just spell it correctly†is a strong statement. People don’t talk about EQ besides in game any more. When EQ first started it was on the 6:00 news and wrote about in all the gaming magazines. The other statement “You have to spend money to make money†is very important in the business world and on a MMORPG population is money. In the fast paced computer world it will take more than just word of mouth anymore. You have to market product.
Speaking about fast pasted. I personally finally broke down, got rid of my Pentium 3, 2.5ram, 9600 radon video card & 19in tube monitor. Bought a quad, 4gig ram, 1gig Nvida card, & 23†LCD and what a difference. Detail in graphics, movement, content & game play in my opinion still beat wow hands down. The thing that makes wow is, if you trip on it long enough you will pick it up….SoE, make EQ a house old name AGAIN.
Come visit my housing creations 20+ in Cedar Country Meadows, ZEK.
WoW didn't start with TV commercials on Day One. That came after it already had several million subscribers, 6-8x more than EQ had at its peak.
The simplest answer is that SOE's never going to throw a bunch of money into a decade old game. They just aren't. They'd rather try to develop the next new thing than try to convince people that the next new thing is a game from 1999.
The simplest answer is that SOE's never going to throw a bunch of money into a decade old game. They just aren't. They'd rather try to develop the next new thing than try to convince people that the next new thing is a game from 1999.
Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
World of Warcraft the way the game is now was released on November 23, 2004, on the 10th anniversary of the Warcraft Franchise.
The first expansion set of the game, the Burning Crusade was released on January 16, 2007
WoW is now almost 5 years old. Last TV commercial I saw was last night. When is a game too old to market? I don’t think WoW even looks at SoE’s EQ as competition anymore. WoW’s is the video game console and enticing the youth to sit in front of a pc then to plug in their Xbox, Wii or Playstation.
100,000 X $15 = $1,500,000.00 a month. Not bad. I think, as a business and the growing use of the internet, without hardly any outside investment in advertising not a bad gig. Why would you not increase the game? If anything get rid of their other dogs of games and invest that into EQ. There is a loyal following and all you could do is add to your profit. Not like EQ is going away. Just needs to be pushed “A LITTLEâ€. They need to invest.
The first expansion set of the game, the Burning Crusade was released on January 16, 2007
WoW is now almost 5 years old. Last TV commercial I saw was last night. When is a game too old to market? I don’t think WoW even looks at SoE’s EQ as competition anymore. WoW’s is the video game console and enticing the youth to sit in front of a pc then to plug in their Xbox, Wii or Playstation.
100,000 X $15 = $1,500,000.00 a month. Not bad. I think, as a business and the growing use of the internet, without hardly any outside investment in advertising not a bad gig. Why would you not increase the game? If anything get rid of their other dogs of games and invest that into EQ. There is a loyal following and all you could do is add to your profit. Not like EQ is going away. Just needs to be pushed “A LITTLEâ€. They need to invest.
Come visit my housing creations 20+ in Cedar Country Meadows, ZEK.
Vinney wrote:
... Not like EQ is going away. Just needs to be pushed “A LITTLEâ€. They need to invest.
I think they will push the next generation EQ. Sony (SoE) didn't get to be a massive corporation without learning lessons along the way (cough... Beta video).
Advertising EQ could actually have a negative impact on the newer or future games in the stable: A solid ad campaign entices bunches of new people to play and they discover there is no locatable population under level 75 on most servers... the graphics are extremely dated by modern standards (I know people that dismiss EQ from that factor alone)and the UI lacks the "WoW-feel" that pretty much every game since WoW has at least worked from... and so on.
Toyota doesn't market their 1977 compact cars, but they benefit from the rep those cars helped establish. They would be foolish to put those rep-setting cars under the modern microscope --more than floormats would be seen as crappy today.
Sony will invest their money in a fantasy-setting mmo PVE game they think can unseat enough of WoW's playerbase to make it worthwhile --including if that means folding several of their older titles into it or sacrificing their development for this next "golden goose".
In the meantime, EQ will make money for years as is until it potentially dwindles down to nothing --people should be glad it still makes "business sense" for SoE to add content and service the game.
Quote:
In the meantime, EQ will make money for years as is until it potentially dwindles down to nothing --people should be glad it still makes "business sense" for SoE to add content and service the game.
SoE doesn’t just add content or service the game. The addition of their off- line sales of items for real dollars within game. The card base game tied in with EQ and the cost to by the other pkgs. Their once a year expansions. Are all marketing tools to enhance their bottom dollar. All I am asking for is an effort to enhance population on their existing servers. I feel Mayong server hurt the population base of the other servers. It did bring some people back but would have been more effective if the server was made available to the “NEW†player. The gamers they are missing because of lack of marketing. Mayong cannibalized the other servers.
There are 4816 Game Stop stores in world. Will give them 4500 store's in US Divide them up into 4 regions. Guesstimation 1125 stores a region. Cost of reproducing a game on disk, packaging it and shipping 50 game disk per store…..rough estimate and going high. $1 a disk or $50 per store X 1125 = $56,250. Do a region once every three months and spread the marketing campaign to cover the year. Total, if there are 100k subscriptions, $1,500,000.00 a month X 3 months = $4.5mil gross. The Counter display = 1.25% of this gross. …I think it is doable…I might not pick GameStop they are not a big PC store. But you need a counter so the consumer will see it when the purchase their WoW merchandise (lol) but I used it as an example.
Now let’s say that we get 1% of the new players. Or 562 players that become die hard. They will spend $180 for subscription + $40 for new expansion a year and if they play the card game or buy from the in game market would be extra? This comes out to 562 X $220 = $123,640 not bad for a $56k investment. This is not counting the % that will pay to play and extra month or more. Times this by 4 for the regions = $494,560. And I think these figures are low. This took me a half hour to figure if that much time.
SoE’s marketing team needs to cut their coffee break down to just 7.5 hours a day and they might enhance our population.
Come visit my housing creations 20+ in Cedar Country Meadows, ZEK.
Having come from playing other games (than EQ) since '04, I may be in a place where I see gamer dissatisfaction more than others. Then again, playing any game for 10 years is probably enough to induce a certain level of "been there, done that" boredom.
For the last several months I've been bopping around between Spellborn, WoW, Runes of Magic, DDO, and now EQ. There was recently a forum post on mmorpg.com regarding Vanguard and it was well written enough to get both my wife and I to both download the 14 day trial. We had both seen Vanguard in beta and basically quit out of complete frustration. I don't mean to turn this into a Vanguard post by any means, that game still has serious issues - but good posts about EQ on sites like mmorpg could bring people back for the trial, or even as resubscribers like me. I'm having a total blast playing EQ again, and there are other people out there that have no idea how much EQ changed since they left. Tell them if you can!
I find it funny that it's the players that are proselytizing Sony games but... whatever it takes.
Not sure if links work for non-premium... here it is:
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/255407/Bored-of-your-MMO-Play-Vanguard-Saga-of-Heroes.html
For the last several months I've been bopping around between Spellborn, WoW, Runes of Magic, DDO, and now EQ. There was recently a forum post on mmorpg.com regarding Vanguard and it was well written enough to get both my wife and I to both download the 14 day trial. We had both seen Vanguard in beta and basically quit out of complete frustration. I don't mean to turn this into a Vanguard post by any means, that game still has serious issues - but good posts about EQ on sites like mmorpg could bring people back for the trial, or even as resubscribers like me. I'm having a total blast playing EQ again, and there are other people out there that have no idea how much EQ changed since they left. Tell them if you can!
I find it funny that it's the players that are proselytizing Sony games but... whatever it takes.
Not sure if links work for non-premium... here it is:
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/255407/Bored-of-your-MMO-Play-Vanguard-Saga-of-Heroes.html
Advertising would go a long way. Luckily the Marketing Manager job is open at SoE, they got an ad up for applications on craiglist, posted Oct 2nd...
http://austin.craigslist.org/mar/1403384540.html
I think the biggest reason WoW was able to get & hold so many people ... was EQ's lack of advertising. Most WoW players think EQ is dead, if they have even heard of it before. Alot of them would enjoy EQ more than WOW, they just don't know it.
http://austin.craigslist.org/mar/1403384540.html
I think the biggest reason WoW was able to get & hold so many people ... was EQ's lack of advertising. Most WoW players think EQ is dead, if they have even heard of it before. Alot of them would enjoy EQ more than WOW, they just don't know it.
Scholar
43 posts
These recurring discussions of SOE's advertising or lack thereof remind me of similar discussions in my corner of the IT world. A particular technology that I often use has existed for decades and has acquired a small but fierce following. Its proponents maintain that it's the best thing since sliced bread and that the only reason that it's slowly dying rather than growing is lack of advertising. However, when you compare it with mainstream technologies, it quickly becomes clear that, although it does have a couple of nifty features, overall it's hopelessly behind the times and should have died a natural death along with DOS 3.1. The only reason that it still sort of survives is that it's used in all kinds of legacy applications that can't be easily rewritten.
Now, I am not saying that EQ is similarly obsolete and should go the way of the dinosaurs. There are certain things that I quite like about EQ just like there are certain things that I quite like about WOW. However, there appears to be a pattern here: lack of advertising is the first thing that gets blamed whenever a sentimental favorite is beaten in the marketplace.
Now, I am not saying that EQ is similarly obsolete and should go the way of the dinosaurs. There are certain things that I quite like about EQ just like there are certain things that I quite like about WOW. However, there appears to be a pattern here: lack of advertising is the first thing that gets blamed whenever a sentimental favorite is beaten in the marketplace.
Windows 3.1??
The last DOS was 6.22...
The last DOS was 6.22...
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Scholar
43 posts
I was just using DOS 3.1 to give an indication of how old the technology in question was :)
I don't buy into the the game is to old crap personally. Counter Strike is an old game too but it still has gobs of people playing and I have never seen an advertisement for it.
EQ started out as a giant purely because there just wasn't anything better out there at the time. But it had some fatal flaws that those over at Sony would not (and still won't) address. The biggest being the huge gap in group and raid gear with absolutely no way of making up the gap.You can play 24/7 for a year in group only play and the worst raider in the game will have at least 2 times your gear.
Even though there is no way to "win" in EQ, most people at least want to feel like they are keeping up with the Jones's.
A great example of this is when I did a little digging to see what kind of pet focus items I could get for my mage in the new expansion. As you progress through the group progression Void A,B,C ect.. more powerful pet focus's become available. As it turns out even the Void F pet focus is not as powerful as the very lowest raid focus that becomes available after only one raid. The same goes for the armor. My obvious conclusion was why bother as I don't have the time nor the desire to raid anymore. The mage will always be second class no matter how much time I put into him. There is absolutely no alternative.
This the reason I think people don't stick with the game and it has no buzz.
Edited, Oct 18th 2009 8:17am by Boomsticker
EQ started out as a giant purely because there just wasn't anything better out there at the time. But it had some fatal flaws that those over at Sony would not (and still won't) address. The biggest being the huge gap in group and raid gear with absolutely no way of making up the gap.You can play 24/7 for a year in group only play and the worst raider in the game will have at least 2 times your gear.
Even though there is no way to "win" in EQ, most people at least want to feel like they are keeping up with the Jones's.
A great example of this is when I did a little digging to see what kind of pet focus items I could get for my mage in the new expansion. As you progress through the group progression Void A,B,C ect.. more powerful pet focus's become available. As it turns out even the Void F pet focus is not as powerful as the very lowest raid focus that becomes available after only one raid. The same goes for the armor. My obvious conclusion was why bother as I don't have the time nor the desire to raid anymore. The mage will always be second class no matter how much time I put into him. There is absolutely no alternative.
This the reason I think people don't stick with the game and it has no buzz.
Edited, Oct 18th 2009 8:17am by Boomsticker
I agree. WoW has modified the game nicely to the point where non-raiders can, with a reasonable amount of effort, uber up their toons very nicely. I know WoW players who were obsessive raiders who now never raid but are more than content with improving their mains with battlegrounds and the other events which I don't even fully understand. They don't feel discriminated against as non-raiders and even those without a LOT of time to play are able to advance their toons nicely.
If EQ maintains this heavy pro-raider mentality, some day in the not so future the game will be reduced to one server with a tiny hard core of 12-hours-per-day get-a-life type hard core raiders.
If EQ maintains this heavy pro-raider mentality, some day in the not so future the game will be reduced to one server with a tiny hard core of 12-hours-per-day get-a-life type hard core raiders.
Sippin 115 DRU **** Firiona Vie ****Agnarr
FV: 115 WAR ENC CLE MAG WIZ SHD SHM Master Alchemist ROG Master Tinkerer & Poison-Maker
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Agnarr: 65 DRU ENC SHD MAG CLE ROG WIZ BRD WAR
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Sippin wrote:
I agree. WoW has modified the game nicely to the point where non-raiders can, with a reasonable amount of effort, uber up their toons very nicely. I know WoW players who were obsessive raiders who now never raid but are more than content with improving their mains with battlegrounds and the other events which I don't even fully understand. They don't feel discriminated against as non-raiders and even those without a LOT of time to play are able to advance their toons nicely.
If EQ maintains this heavy pro-raider mentality, some day in the not so future the game will be reduced to one server with a tiny hard core of 12-hours-per-day get-a-life type hard core raiders.
If EQ maintains this heavy pro-raider mentality, some day in the not so future the game will be reduced to one server with a tiny hard core of 12-hours-per-day get-a-life type hard core raiders.
An interesting point.
Maybe:
If they made the raid content about Glitz and style and not about the best statted loots (but still equal to the best statted loots obtained via long group-content based quests) I think you'd have a decent balance.
Suppose a 3 hours x 5 nights = the estimated timeline for typical completion of an uber group task reward, or you do one raid successfully for the same reward.
Just make the raids give everybody something (unlike older ones where 4 people benefitted from the group's efforts). With the current task system this wouldn't be hard to do. The raid loots themselves should just be a candy-box of useful things (like spells/tomes, cultural armor drops, etc.) --the Warrior would get the uber warrior sword from his/her respective task for doing the raid.
They'd gain more mileage if they did a graphics revamp and disable the current dye system. Making raid loots for visible armor look different and exist in rare colours would create demand. Let the common masses dresses like commoners! (and I am a commoner). Why would I want to raid uber_zone_x for the fancy black robe if I can just get the group content one and dye it black (since they have the same stats)? Huge mistake back in the day implementing dye as they did.
It becomes a tricky massive argument because deeply rooted premises in the game, with layers and layers of decisons upon them, all factor into the current state of things.
I like the idea of long "hard" quests, doable with a combo of solo/group effort, ending in a prize of top-of-the-line raid-quality loot. Non-raiding types could work on this quest whenever they log on and have something to do even if they can't find a group.
The workload has to be reasonable though, to compete with WoW. WoW has dumbed down quests and if a quest takes 3 months and 100s of hours of camping rare spawns, no matter how nice the loot they will end up us another batch of nails in the EQ coffin.
The workload has to be reasonable though, to compete with WoW. WoW has dumbed down quests and if a quest takes 3 months and 100s of hours of camping rare spawns, no matter how nice the loot they will end up us another batch of nails in the EQ coffin.
Sippin 115 DRU **** Firiona Vie ****Agnarr
FV: 115 WAR ENC CLE MAG WIZ SHD SHM Master Alchemist ROG Master Tinkerer & Poison-Maker
Master Artisan (300+) * Baker * Brewer * Fletcher * Jeweler * Potter * Researcher * Smith * Tailor
Agnarr: 65 DRU ENC SHD MAG CLE ROG WIZ BRD WAR
FV: 115 WAR ENC CLE MAG WIZ SHD SHM Master Alchemist ROG Master Tinkerer & Poison-Maker
Master Artisan (300+) * Baker * Brewer * Fletcher * Jeweler * Potter * Researcher * Smith * Tailor
Agnarr: 65 DRU ENC SHD MAG CLE ROG WIZ BRD WAR
Quote:
I like the idea of long "hard" quests, doable with a combo of solo/group effort, ending in a prize of top-of-the-line raid-quality loot. Non-raiding types could work on this quest whenever they log on and have something to do even if they can't find a group.
I totally agree. I have always loved doing epic quests for that very reason. Nothing to do? Go spend a few hours on the epic quest. They need many many more of these type of quests instead of spending hours on a quest that yields almost junk.
Edited, Oct 24th 2009 10:19pm by Boomsticker
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