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If you keep flashing every so often you won't lose hate, but once you do it's a pain to get it back because Flash seems to be more effective if the mobs are looking at you. In my limited experience this phase, MRD seem to hold hate better than GLA so hopefully something is done about that before launch.
Wint wrote:
If you keep flashing every so often you won't lose hate, but once you do it's a pain to get it back because Flash seems to be more effective if the mobs are looking at you. In my limited experience this phase, MRD seem to hold hate better than GLA so hopefully something is done about that before launch.
Overpower seems a bit overpowered. That's the main difference between MRD and GLA right now.
Edit: If they removed Flash from cross class abilities, it would probably be a bit fairer.
Edited, Jul 12th 2013 3:25pm by FrozenSherbet
IKickYoDog wrote:
After getting to devote real time to the beta this week, I have made a solid decision on how I feel about one thing. Archers are annoying as hell. Especially the ones who don't wait for the tank to grab hate, then just run in spamming abilities and running in circles. As a Lancer, it gets very tiresome chasing the dumb ARC all around Copperbell Mines trying to complete combos.
I would really like SE to change this mechanic before launch. Whether by making moving interrupt your attack, or imposing a significant accuracy penalty. I should not miss vorpal thrust so many times in a row that my combo effect disappears when fighting a giant gigas.
And Archers, it's almost the same principle as FFXI, for those of you who played. Don't run away when you're in a sealed, instanced zone. You will ultimately take more hits from ppl not gaining hate than you can dodge by running around like a fool.
I would really like SE to change this mechanic before launch. Whether by making moving interrupt your attack, or imposing a significant accuracy penalty. I should not miss vorpal thrust so many times in a row that my combo effect disappears when fighting a giant gigas.
And Archers, it's almost the same principle as FFXI, for those of you who played. Don't run away when you're in a sealed, instanced zone. You will ultimately take more hits from ppl not gaining hate than you can dodge by running around like a fool.
I agree with you but,I LOVE ARCHER!!! Not when archer pulls hate of course. Archer was the last of 11 classes that I learned and for me, its by far the best. However, you need to learn how to balance damage with hate. If I were a healer, I wouldn't heal the archer, that would teach that class.
As an archer I use a Pug trait, Featherfoot for dodge, and cure from Conj . I'm bleary eyed from playing. I made it to level 13. no more time to spend on the game, but 11 classes later, and heck, Archer doesn't run out of ammo! In ffxi I had to make my own arrows.
Targeting is still an issue even after workng 11 classes. I hope to work with the filters some more to resolve this.
Oh, p.s. the first archer I saw was jumping up and down to avoid getting hit. It was very funny.
Edited, Jul 12th 2013 7:06pm by Grandmomma
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FrozenSherbet wrote:
Transmigration wrote:
Seraphknight777 wrote:
Transmigration wrote:
IKickYoDog wrote:
After getting to devote real time to the beta this week, I have made a solid decision on how I feel about one thing. Archers are annoying as hell. Especially the ones who don't wait for the tank to grab hate, then just run in spamming abilities and running in circles. As a Lancer, it gets very tiresome chasing the dumb ARC all around Copperbell Mines trying to complete combos.
I would really like SE to change this mechanic before launch. Whether by making moving interrupt your attack, or imposing a significant accuracy penalty. I should not miss vorpal thrust so many times in a row that my combo effect disappears when fighting a giant gigas.
And Archers, it's almost the same principle as FFXI, for those of you who played. Don't run away when you're in a sealed, instanced zone. You will ultimately take more hits from ppl not gaining hate than you can dodge by running around like a fool.
I would really like SE to change this mechanic before launch. Whether by making moving interrupt your attack, or imposing a significant accuracy penalty. I should not miss vorpal thrust so many times in a row that my combo effect disappears when fighting a giant gigas.
And Archers, it's almost the same principle as FFXI, for those of you who played. Don't run away when you're in a sealed, instanced zone. You will ultimately take more hits from ppl not gaining hate than you can dodge by running around like a fool.
#1. Archers don't do very much DPS, so it's either
#2. Archers kite adds. When you kite, you slow/bind the mob and run/sprint while dumping arrows in to them to kill the mob without stressing the healer who is keeping you (the melee) alive.
#3. See #1^
This is not like FFXI. It is not designed to "let the tank get threat first!" and ranged dps is not supposed to stand in one spot and get hit like fools.
SE needs to implement abilities from WoW's Hunter like Feign Death (play dead, monster runs back to tank) and Misdirection (think trick attack, but for Archer).
Edited, Jul 12th 2013 5:09am by Transmigration
Wint beat me to it while I was getting breakfast >:O lol
The underlined part concerns me. This IS a let the tank get threat first game. At least a Flash/Overpower, or a Shield Lob/Tomahawk. It may not be "wait for provoke, flash, and a few swings" or "wait for 3 sunder armors" but you still should wait for at least that initial tank aggro. If you are NOT kiting adds and you pull aggro you should do your best to bind/slow the mob to allow the tank to get aggro/hate/threat back while not putting extra strain on the healer. You have to be careful how you say things or you'll have people thinking that its ok to drag a mob halfway across the map, possibly running into more mobs while the tank is chasing them TRYING to get threat back.
I agree on hate manipulation though. Archer is tactical class in general so a low level hate management tool would definitely be welcome.
Edited, Jul 12th 2013 7:53am by Seraphknight777
That's sort of implied. I'm not saying we should run ahead and attack before the tank does, but we shouldn't have to stand there for 5 seconds waiting for him to build up threat either. The problem is in the game design, not the players.
Is there no taunt in this game?
It shouldn't take a tank 5 seconds to build threat. A Flash at the start of the battle should be enough to get things going. After that, MRDs can spam Overpower a couple times to ensure attention stays on them, and GLA has an enmity generating combo. MRDs should pretty much never lose hate. GLA has it rougher with Flash as their only decent AoE hate grab.
And yet they do.. I've pulled threat on dungeon bosses even after waiting for the MRD to generate some threat. I've used multishot/quick knock 20 seconds in to a fight and still pulled the other 2 mobs off of the tank. Archer is a really weak DD . Some thing is wrong with the system.
Wint wrote:
If you keep flashing every so often you won't lose hate, but once you do it's a pain to get it back because Flash seems to be more effective if the mobs are looking at you. In my limited experience this phase, MRD seem to hold hate better than GLA so hopefully something is done about that before launch.
Flash is somewhat weak at generating enmity, but fortunately it's also spammable. Most of the time I only need to use it twice. After that, I only need to switch targets and do a Fast Blade > Savage Blade combo, which is what I usually do if the enmity levels are far in my favor.
MRD is better at AoE tanking thanks to Overpower, but honestly as a 32 GLA thus far, I've barely had tanking issues. If I happen to lose an add, I just Shield Lob or Flash to get it back.
May be my previous MMO experience but Tanking in this game is pretty easy. The Manor has been the most difficult so far, but that's purely because of the Maiden patrols.
Once Paladin Gets Shield Oath, their hate woes are completely gone, to be brutally honest.
Until then, they're still pretty good at keeping hate, they just have to concentrate on it a bit more than Maurader.
And this is coming from someone who aims to be a Warrior Tank.
Until then, they're still pretty good at keeping hate, they just have to concentrate on it a bit more than Maurader.
And this is coming from someone who aims to be a Warrior Tank.
Transmigration wrote:
FrozenSherbet wrote:
Transmigration wrote:
Seraphknight777 wrote:
Transmigration wrote:
IKickYoDog wrote:
After getting to devote real time to the beta this week, I have made a solid decision on how I feel about one thing. Archers are annoying as hell. Especially the ones who don't wait for the tank to grab hate, then just run in spamming abilities and running in circles. As a Lancer, it gets very tiresome chasing the dumb ARC all around Copperbell Mines trying to complete combos.
I would really like SE to change this mechanic before launch. Whether by making moving interrupt your attack, or imposing a significant accuracy penalty. I should not miss vorpal thrust so many times in a row that my combo effect disappears when fighting a giant gigas.
And Archers, it's almost the same principle as FFXI, for those of you who played. Don't run away when you're in a sealed, instanced zone. You will ultimately take more hits from ppl not gaining hate than you can dodge by running around like a fool.
I would really like SE to change this mechanic before launch. Whether by making moving interrupt your attack, or imposing a significant accuracy penalty. I should not miss vorpal thrust so many times in a row that my combo effect disappears when fighting a giant gigas.
And Archers, it's almost the same principle as FFXI, for those of you who played. Don't run away when you're in a sealed, instanced zone. You will ultimately take more hits from ppl not gaining hate than you can dodge by running around like a fool.
#1. Archers don't do very much DPS, so it's either
#2. Archers kite adds. When you kite, you slow/bind the mob and run/sprint while dumping arrows in to them to kill the mob without stressing the healer who is keeping you (the melee) alive.
#3. See #1^
This is not like FFXI. It is not designed to "let the tank get threat first!" and ranged dps is not supposed to stand in one spot and get hit like fools.
SE needs to implement abilities from WoW's Hunter like Feign Death (play dead, monster runs back to tank) and Misdirection (think trick attack, but for Archer).
Edited, Jul 12th 2013 5:09am by Transmigration
Wint beat me to it while I was getting breakfast >:O lol
The underlined part concerns me. This IS a let the tank get threat first game. At least a Flash/Overpower, or a Shield Lob/Tomahawk. It may not be "wait for provoke, flash, and a few swings" or "wait for 3 sunder armors" but you still should wait for at least that initial tank aggro. If you are NOT kiting adds and you pull aggro you should do your best to bind/slow the mob to allow the tank to get aggro/hate/threat back while not putting extra strain on the healer. You have to be careful how you say things or you'll have people thinking that its ok to drag a mob halfway across the map, possibly running into more mobs while the tank is chasing them TRYING to get threat back.
I agree on hate manipulation though. Archer is tactical class in general so a low level hate management tool would definitely be welcome.
Edited, Jul 12th 2013 7:53am by Seraphknight777
That's sort of implied. I'm not saying we should run ahead and attack before the tank does, but we shouldn't have to stand there for 5 seconds waiting for him to build up threat either. The problem is in the game design, not the players.
Is there no taunt in this game?
It shouldn't take a tank 5 seconds to build threat. A Flash at the start of the battle should be enough to get things going. After that, MRDs can spam Overpower a couple times to ensure attention stays on them, and GLA has an enmity generating combo. MRDs should pretty much never lose hate. GLA has it rougher with Flash as their only decent AoE hate grab.
And yet they do.. I've pulled threat on dungeon bosses even after waiting for the MRD to generate some threat. I've used multishot/quick knock 20 seconds in to a fight and still pulled the other 2 mobs off of the tank. Archer is a really weak DD . Some thing is wrong with the system.
That really isn't a problem with system so much as it is a problem with the MRD you have tanking. Either they are wearing severely suboptimal gear, or they just aren't taking advantage of how much hate Overpower and Skull Sunder can generate. I never lost hate on MRD regardless of whether or not the party focused on the same mob.
As of right now, the only MRDs I've seen struggle are the ones that don't know they should carry Flash yet. The only thing you can do is politely tell them how to perform their role better. I haven't personally met one that has been unreceptive to advice, but I'm sure there's plenty of those out there.
ARC really isn't as weak as you're making it out to be, though. Especially in the beginner dungeons, critical hits can do some pretty decent damage. Combine that with DoT skills like Venomous Shot and Fracture, and ARC can generate quite a bit of threat.
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