"roll for shard"???Follow

I was running BRD with some random poeple and it was going great untill some blue BOP started dropping. Half the time no one could use it, so i asked if i could DE it and use the shard. they said you have to "roll on shard". that means I DE it and we roll, and the highest roller will get the shard. Does this seem fair? Becuase it is my proffesion and it is the only way that i can get mats. so i think that it is fair that i should get the shard. Becuase say a rly nice jewel drops that a JC can use, i don't think people are going to try to need it becuase he can "use" it. people just want to sell. Am I right or wrong?

I see what u mean, but after all how else will i get mats and make a profit? if i want to lvl enchanting it seems as if the only way is to buy mats of the AH that are ridiculously over priced. I think that if noone can use it, and there is a chanter that needs the mat it should go to him.

You think prices on the AH are high now for mats? See what would happen if no enchanters DE'd for other people.

But, if you want to only DE for yourself, go ahead and not tell anyone you're an enchanter and all those disenchantables can get vendored. But to say that only you deserve the mat is selfish, as you're taking the coin away from someone else who could vendor it.

sounds to me like your greedy...those BOP blues vendor for 1g at least....so your saying you want to need it and DE it and keep the shard for yourself?

How about it this way. Go in if noone needs it, you de it and split the profit with everyone. ie you pay them maybe 30s each for something that will be vendored for 1g. but the shard would cost maybe 2-3g. You come out with 80s to 1g80s profit and noone can say they lost anything. you gained the shard at a cheap price, they gained some gold and are kept happy. problem solved.

i like what addeer said it makes the most sense to me and i think that it is fair. thx for the help.

I'll just say 'Need' and 'Greed'. They want the shard to sell, you want the shard to level your enchanting.


I disagree with anyone who calls you greedy, there the greedy ones. :)

Furthermore, Need only applies to gear that you'll use to wear, and certain BoP crafting mats.

i see what all of u mean and i am reconsidering what all of you said. i will just need time now to think about what to do about enchanting. i also agree with factal. i think the main reason for putting shards for so much $$$ is because there is no deposit. so a common person think, ok no deposit huh? ill just put it up for 3 times the price. i don't care if anyone buys it becuase i can just put it back up again. i hate when people say that to me. and sometimes you are in such a need and you don't want to wait and u just have to get so u buy it!!!!!!!!! well, enchanters i think we all need to lower our prices on the mats. in the end it will prolly get u more gold and happyness for all.

Congrats on proving my point.

So, If a Whitemains hat drops in SM while I'm playing on my warrior, should I roll against a preist for it? I would be better of with that 40 silver, just as (s)he would be better of using it as gear. SO if I twist your words abit it seems like you are saying that everyone in the group has the right to roll on any peice of eqiptment that drops, for the sake of vendoring?

Say for example, my character is a skinner and I am running wailing caverns, should my group roll on the leather that I skin? I might need it to make a deviate scale belt, and that might be the reason that I am there (that being the loot I want) but, according to you, the rest of my party should be able to roll on it because they could AH the scales for 30ish silver each? I have witnessed a pally spend his DKP to outbid several mages/warlocks on an Azuresong mageblade, but thats ok isnt it? It will aid his Judgements slightly, and probably get him a gold or two when he vendors it. (then again, It was his DKP that he spent, so this is slightly less relevant that the other two points.)

The majority of PUG's I have been in have been happy for skinners to keep their skin, Miners to keep their ore and ENCHANTERS to keep their shards. Also, (@ polderan) why is eqiptment consideres a reason to need, yet needing on an essence of fire to make that Blue leather hat you want is not considered (by you) to be a reason to need. Mabey that hat is also eqiptment which according to you and what you think people should need on.

[END]RANT[/END]

BoP vs BoE. I'm of a mind that all BoEs are greed unless you're with a guild group. If Essence of Fire was BoP, I'm sure need would take effect. Obviously, if a group agrees to special rules, then the group agrees to them.

Furthermore, I can go out, alone, and farm essence of fire. I cannot(at a level where I'd want it) farm Whitemane's Chapeau.



If it's a genuine upgrade for you, then it's a need.



Can you sell the corpse for multiple gold before it's skinned? Nope, it just sits there and rots. Same with herbs, and mining. They have absolutely no value until you skin/herb/mine them. Blue BoP gear, on the other hand, has value to non-enchanters. Enchanters may gain more value from them, but the non-greedy enchanters can take something that someone won, and give it more value at no cost to themselves.



Actually, Azuresong Mageblade was a good tanking sword for paladins(not that anyone ever let them tank pre-TBC). But that one all depends on guild loot rules and really has nothing to do with this issue.

You're a little slow aren't you. See the difference is (and this is why rolling need for alts, etc isn't acceptable) that the person who can use the item as gear? That person can, right then and there, equip that item for the betterment of the group's run.

In the case of equipable items, equip trumps vendor/sale.



A mageblade is an entirely acceptable weapon for a paladin, particularly a tanking one. And besides it's a red herring, it's a DKP thing.

But to your skinning example. If you're not there there's nothing to take. I can't lug a raptor out of WC and vendor it or have someone make me a belt out of it. It's as if that skin doesn't even exist without a skinner. However, the BoP drop most certainly does exist whether the enchanter is there or not. The very fact that someone is an enchanter doesn't give them priority on something that would exist without them. You don't want to D/E and roll on a shard? Fine, we'll roll for the item and you can do what you want if you win. If I win I'll vendor it.

Also, you act as though BoP items are the only drops enchanters can d/e in the whole group. "If I twist your words a little", with your skinning reference you're saying that enchanters should get EVERY uncommon item that drops that can't be immediately used by other players because it's like skinning, right? Right?



I call BS on the enchanters part - if it's the random BoE loots that they won from a greed roll, of course. They're welcome to do what they wish with that. If it's the BoP stuff and everyone passed? Shenanigans. My guildies do that - well, actually whoever can D/E is generally told to just take it and usually what happens is he divvies it all up at the end and either enchants our stuff or gives us the mats.

But I have NEVER seen that happen in a PuG run.



Because I need that Essence of Fire as an alchemist or to take to crafter or whatever to have them make something that I need and is important to me too. Ever read the trade channel? "Free with your mats". Where do you think those mats come from if the crafters are needing on everything (purely to devote it to their craft, of course)?

Oh and as an enchanter? I'd feel like quite the greedy bastage hording D/E'd BoPs (that everyone passed on) in instances. Really, I'd feel like a heel. If a BoP drops and everyone passes, I'm usually the one to suggest the roll. I offer to d/e as a courtesy to my group. If they'd rather just vendor the weapon that's fine by me. It's never occurred to me to look upon the ability to D/E as meaning I have more right to the stuff.

But that's just me, call me greedy crazy.

edit: Argh you all beat me to it!


Edited, Apr 2nd 2007 2:28am by Celcio