I've all but abandoned questing for the time being and opted to do some grinding in the journey from level 33-40 (unless someone can recommend a really good place for questing at level 33... Desolace just isn't doing it for me).
More to the point, my poor little pig is in trouble. I tamed Bellygrub in Redridge Mountains for Gore 4 and Charge 3. With those two new abilities, I think Piggles has all the innate boar abilities he could possibly have for his level, but he's just not holding hate like he used to. I was in STV fighting Venture Co. Geologists (level 34-35); decent currency drops, silk, and a couple of greens to go with the exp. Piggles was losing hate all the time.
I got attacked by one of those mechanized things you find anywhere the Venture Co. is; it was level 37 and my standard procedure for unintended aggro is to put my pig on it and get to firing range. No luck. Two arrows and an Arcane Shot later and the buzzsaw beastie had turned on me. I dual wield axes for ok damage, but it's nowhere near on par with bow, and it ultimately cuts into profit from my adventures in armor repairs if I pull hate to much.
The final failure came when I was meandering around STV and came across a level 40 non-elite Humanoid (Samantha somethingorother...armored humanoid walking up the path). Level 33 w/pet vs. level 40 is a stretch, I know. I decided to give it a shot and the fight was going very well for a short time; we would have won. Then Piggles lost hate again and nothing I could think of could get it back onto him. I turn and faced away from the mob so I stopped hitting while Piggles continued attacking. I tried running away while Piggles kept attacking. In the end, all I got was a dirt nap and a long wisp back from the graveyard.
There are some things I know I'm doing wrong strategy wise from a defensive perspective:
1) I don't use Concussive Shot or traps (ie. Freeze trap) when I'm grinding. I should. No getting around it. I'd take less damage from stripping hate off my pig if I kept the mob at a distance, but the thought never occurs to me until after the fact.
2) I go a little heavy on the dps; generally speaking, I cycle between Arcane Shot and Serpent Sting as the cast timers are up (primarily BM spec so no Aimed Shot, etc.) I think overall the extra damage is part of the problem.
The only other thing I can think of is that my pig is struggling to hold hate because I'm fighting mobs that are of a higher level than we are. At one point, my pig was two levels behind me which is part of why I started grinding in the first place. Now he's caught up and still struggling, which leads me to think that maybe his hate-holding 'spells' aren't working so well against higher level mobs (Growl, etc.).
So I guess what I'm looking for are some tips. Should I stick to lower level adversaries so that my pig's abilities are resisted less often and save some disruption that way? Or am I overlooking some critical aspect of my pig's development?
My Piggles is usually a first rate tank. My guild (small and growing we are) use him as our main tank in instances. When I was level 31, I was sending him into groups of 3-5 level 25-27 Elites to grab their attention while the party picked them off and he always held his own. It's just a little disconcerting to see the poor little piggy struggling like this. He has this ashamed look on his face every time I call him now...
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When the mobs are higher than you by 3 levels or more there's a big chance your growl will be resisted, if this happens then you'll pull hate very quickly.
When I was at that point I would hold off attacking until i saw one or two growls hit (the little icon overhead).
Once piggy gets two growls in you should have a hard time pulling them off him even with rapid fire.
Although boars are a very good pet I also found that my cat at the same level seemed to hold hate better around the low 30's, not sure why, maybe because around thi stime there should be gore 5 and a new charge but they don't exist?
When I was at that point I would hold off attacking until i saw one or two growls hit (the little icon overhead).
Once piggy gets two growls in you should have a hard time pulling them off him even with rapid fire.
Although boars are a very good pet I also found that my cat at the same level seemed to hold hate better around the low 30's, not sure why, maybe because around thi stime there should be gore 5 and a new charge but they don't exist?
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Although boars are a very good pet I also found that my cat at the same level seemed to hold hate better around the low 30's, not sure why, maybe because around thi stime there should be gore 5 and a new charge but they don't exist?
New yet at Hunter, but I'm going out on a stretch and gonna say your Cat holds better hate because he has higher DPS. If you go agenst a mob that hits very hard you may see a decline in his hate holding ability, or chance killing him quicker.
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So I guess what I'm looking for are some tips. Should I stick to lower level adversaries so that my pig's abilities are resisted less often and save some disruption that way? Or am I overlooking some critical aspect of my pig's development?
When you close in on the next rank Growl (ie; 1-3 levels away from being able to obtain it) you will notice the current Growl isn't as effective as it once was. I know this from main'n Paladin along side my wife's Warlock. When she got her up-graded taunt from the VW, he EASILY pulled hate from me as a tankadin, but after a few levels I noticed I was once again becoming the main Tank and she would switch to the Felhunter. My guess is Blizz sets this up to prevent "super easy" leveling. You need to adapt to your pets current strengths & weaknesses.
Also, if your Gore is on auto, I'd advise turning it off and use it manualy (watch your pets focus closely when doing so). If it's on auto you'll eat his Focus up too fast to keep him Growling. Now there is a talent in the BM tree that can help with Gore on auto, but I don't have experience with it & can't comment about its effectiveness. Me personaly? I use Bite on auto and don't even think about his focus... he's usualy close to full by the next pull.
Edit: Just wanted to add, Lv33 vs Lv40 non-elite. Not a good choice, but fun to see how you match up I guess.
Kz
Edited, Apr 13th 2007 11:24am by Killzon
Like Kelnoen said, fighting mobs 3+ levels above you can be a bit tricky. But I can also say that I’ve done steady grinding on mobs that were 4 levels above me and 5 levels above my pet with very little down time. And that hunter was using a spider pet that only had growl and bite.
The trick is to allow your pet to tick off the mob. If you can, allow your pet to hit first. If you have to pull, use a single arrow and then turn off auto shoot. Once your pet is attacking use a sting and then auto shoot. Towards the end of the fight feel free to use an arcane shot. But if you start out doing a lot of damage then you are most likely going to pull the mob to you.
If growl is resisted and the mob comes towards you, use disengage. This will usually makes the mob turn back to your pet. At least it usually works for me. I’ve also just stopped attacking, took a few hits and let my pet pull the mob back. And there is also the old standby of playing dead.
Also, if you have gore on auto cast, try turning it off. Gore can use so much focus that your piggy may not be using growl as much as is needed. Try not using gore at all and see how it works. If that helps you can always use gore manually.
I would also recommend trying the Spirit Bond talent. Its one of my absolute favorite talents for leveling. The extra healing every ten seconds saves me a tone of down time between pulls and it’s even saved my life a few times when the battle was very close.
The trick is to allow your pet to tick off the mob. If you can, allow your pet to hit first. If you have to pull, use a single arrow and then turn off auto shoot. Once your pet is attacking use a sting and then auto shoot. Towards the end of the fight feel free to use an arcane shot. But if you start out doing a lot of damage then you are most likely going to pull the mob to you.
If growl is resisted and the mob comes towards you, use disengage. This will usually makes the mob turn back to your pet. At least it usually works for me. I’ve also just stopped attacking, took a few hits and let my pet pull the mob back. And there is also the old standby of playing dead.
Also, if you have gore on auto cast, try turning it off. Gore can use so much focus that your piggy may not be using growl as much as is needed. Try not using gore at all and see how it works. If that helps you can always use gore manually.
I would also recommend trying the Spirit Bond talent. Its one of my absolute favorite talents for leveling. The extra healing every ten seconds saves me a tone of down time between pulls and it’s even saved my life a few times when the battle was very close.
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I go a little heavy on the dps; generally speaking, I cycle between Arcane Shot and Serpent Sting as the cast timers are up (primarily BM spec so no Aimed Shot, etc.) I think overall the extra damage is part of the problem.
Very much so I think. I'm still fairly new at Hunter, but I rarely pull aggro. WHat I usually do is send in pet (It's a worg with dash, bite, furious howl and growl if that makes any difference) I don't even start shooting til the pet's there and growling. Then I stick on autofire but usually hold off on Arcane Shot til I see a 2nd growl hit the mob.
Then I'll go to town. I rarely use Stings as there's just no real need in fights vs regular mobs, and when I do, I tend to prefer the debuff from Scorpid Sting. Not sure if that generates less threat.
Hunters kill mobs very fast solo anyway, try holding back a little until your pets gets aggro locked in. Otherwise it's the equivalent of a Rogue going nuts on a target before the tank has even got into position.
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I don't even start shooting til the pet's there and growling.
That's why I LOVE Charge! After 32ish, dash and dive can make up for this (bestial swiftness can a little, but it's only 30%). Less waiting per fight x 1000s of fights = time saved = I will not die of old age waiting for pet to reach target! See? Boars save!
Er.... yeah, nm some of that....
Next point: some mechs are not affected by Growl/taunt. The Westfall harvesters are not (and are a PAIN to fight for this reason). I wonder if those goblin mechanioid pets are invulnerable to growl.
Also, when you get adds late in a fight, sometimes pets are low on focus and lack the focus to growl. Can happen to any pet. If you have the BM talent to regen focus, just turn off gore (or claw) - and it will growl soon.
Your pet can lose agro occasionally because growl is resisted and you crit too much, anyway. Be ready for this. That's when a concussive shot -- or run through it doing a wing-clip (cheetah off) and then kite it! Freeze or frost trap.
As to cats "holding more agro than ___" -- no, I have not seen this. I've played almost every pet there is. Cats actually, in my experience, are bad at holding agro because they have Claw, and a long time ago I used to leave bite and claw on (my The Rake came w/ it, and I needed Claw for bg/pvp). For one fight, sure, bite/claw was an agro magnet. Then an add hit the pet, and Senor Keety had no focus. Hello agro! I learned to pve w/ bite and growl only.
If any pets are "magic agro magnets" its ones that screech (I'm not sure this is an empirically proven fact, but Screech from bats, owls and carion birds seems to do really well, combined w/ growl, at holding agro -- part of the reason Screech is thought to be so good at this is that one pet has screeched once or twice at multiple targets, you can multishoot them and often not pull agro!). Wolves self-buffed w/ furious Howl and Pigs Charging in seem a tad better than other pets at holding agro. Gorillas stomping are decent (gorillas are slow tho - only way to speed their run speed is beastial swiftness talent).
Hunting in STV, especially those dang Goblins, imo it's really important to not fall into the rut of send pet and shoot, send pet and shoot. They are small and hard to see. They have patrols - or roamers. Some are in clusters. The more you send pet and shoot, the more likely pet is to attract adds - adds that then summon mechanoids to fight - and then you are in trouble. I would start at an edge. Clear the tigers or panthers that roamed first. Make an area "safe". Then I'd pull the goblin to my safe spot to fight. If they have a range attack you have to shoot and back up to make them run to you (a skill you need to learn to pull - don't assume that because they do range attacks they will not follow you - this is an error many players make). Then keep in mind repops will come. If repops or respawns catch you, that's a great time to lay a freezing trap, wingclip the one not in the trap, and run for hte road. And maybe go back and look for a "safer" angle of attack on their area.
Even though the boar hits a bad speedbump in Gore and Charge in this area - in the 30s - he's not that weak. Growl and Bite can be 100%, and you can pve on those alone. Add charge - and he hsould do fine - and will do even better when at last you can get better charges and gores.
Consider pve'ing w/ gore off if there is a target rich environment and a possibility of an add. If you don't have the focus regen'ing talent, get it if you want to use Gore. You may want it anyway - as any pet will run low on focus in long fights or using no-cooldown abs, like gore and claw.
See if this works and come back - we'll try to help you if you're still having probs. Oh, the other are right in that anything 3 lvls and above = many more RESISTS. Let the pet land a growl before you shoot. I believe the animation for growl working is a ' ' ' sort of thingie in blueish purple above target. The word "RESIST" appears over target if it resists growl (but it can resist other things, too, like your traps). Learn to verify a successful Growl. Also get you pet leveled to you to hunt bigger game - I think the resist chance is calc'd off pet's level. GL!
(edit- if hunting higher lvl stuff, you will draw agro w/ ANY pet - because midfight the target will sometimes resist a key growl or two. Just be ready for this. Be far away from target if u can. Concuss Shot. Have routines down - freezing trap if you have no sting on it - frost trap - wing clip - or wing clip and damage (fire) trap. Kite. Learn to kite - to stay out of its melee range and just AS and sting. Sometimes fighting high lvl stuff you only autoshoot or you only autoshoot and sting, to keep your dps down - and you don't AS - your bm talents help the pet do its share of killing - and when target it over halfway dead - then you can think about AS'ing and doing more dps)
Edited, Apr 13th 2007 3:48pm by IponemaGirl
A successful growl looks like a few little lightning bolts over teh mob's head.
Kind of like Roar or Taunt from Bear Druid/Warrior, respectively, but it does look a little different.
You'll know it when you see it.
Kind of like Roar or Taunt from Bear Druid/Warrior, respectively, but it does look a little different.
You'll know it when you see it.
Thanks for the tips everyone ^^
I'll turn off auto-Gore the next time I call out my pet and see if that helps. I notice that unless the fights are very, very fast, my pig is usually out of focus long before the end of the fight. I didn't realize Gore had no cool down...
Also, I'll stick to the lower level mobs in STV until I'm at least 34, possibly 35 to match the level of most of the mobs I was fighting there.
I'll turn off auto-Gore the next time I call out my pet and see if that helps. I notice that unless the fights are very, very fast, my pig is usually out of focus long before the end of the fight. I didn't realize Gore had no cool down...
Also, I'll stick to the lower level mobs in STV until I'm at least 34, possibly 35 to match the level of most of the mobs I was fighting there.
Yeah, I have an owl I normally use, and grabbed a pig since everyone was talking them up. Much to my dismay, the pig wasn't very good at holding aggro! My owl is _great_ at holding it! I have no idea why. Maybe it's smarter and gets its skills resisted less? At level 36 It was able to hold aggro on level 40 mobs sufficiently to go pretty thick on damage.
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unless someone can recommend a really good place for questing at level 33
Quests that require you to grind - and doing several at once - that's pretty much the fastest exp gain there is.
If you are having probs, I suggest you Google "Jame's WoW guide" or "Jame's horde leveling guide" or "Jame's Alliance leveling guide" - one of those will work. And it's "Jame's" not "James'".
Even if you don't follow the guide to the letter (it's FREE, it actually does work, but it's not for everyone - following a guide is about as exciting as following the recipes on a box of cake mix), it will at least give you an idea of what and where some good quests are. GL!
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My owl is _great_ at holding it! I have no idea why.
Owls have screech. And screech is a great agro magnet. That’s why I usually recommend owls, bats or carrion birds to marksmanship hunters that have trouble with their pets holding agro.
Personally, I would fire off a serpent shot....run up, and hit a wing clip, then back up and fire away!
I lay down traps (just in case), but I never rip the hate from my pet.
Edited, Apr 17th 2007 4:17pm by Jaquio
I lay down traps (just in case), but I never rip the hate from my pet.
Edited, Apr 17th 2007 4:17pm by Jaquio
Dumb and happy here :P
My pig has finally reached level 63!! As soon as I taught him Gore 8, Charge 6, and Growl 9(?) he has been holding aggro even when I crit 4200+ on my aimed shot!! F-IN AWESOME!!!!
My pig has finally reached level 63!! As soon as I taught him Gore 8, Charge 6, and Growl 9(?) he has been holding aggro even when I crit 4200+ on my aimed shot!! F-IN AWESOME!!!!
Might be a dumb question, but why didn't you feign death?
Please "talk up" if your comprehension white-shifts. I will use simple-happy language-words to help you understand.
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