Princess ShadorVIII wrote:
Cue 50-page debate about Alma's attitude.
What's there to debate? It sucks, and he'll never be self-aware enough to truly consider that. End of story.
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What's there to debate? It sucks, and he'll never be self-aware enough to truly consider that. End of story.
#28Almalieque,
Posted: Jun 21 2011 at 11:54 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Since I'm not "self-aware" enough, why don't you educate me on how it sucks and is somehow different from any other poster here?
Allegory wrote:
That's comparing a sea to a puddle. There are zero external pressures forcing a straight person into a gay lifestyle, and loads flowing the opposite direction.
I wasn't talking about pressures for a straight person to get into the gay lifestyle, but pointing out that some straight guys end out there (male teen runaways are a common case), and once there they are subjected to absolutely massive pressure to stay. And even as they get older and realize that they really aren't comfortable with what they're doing, they feel that pressure, don't know what to do, and often overcompensate by becoming "super gay". I suspect that's what happened to the guy in the OP.
Quote:
gbaji wrote:
There are enormous pressures within the gay community to continue to "be gay", and far more to be actively gay than there are among straight people. To be fair, that's to be expected when one is a smaller group, but it doesn't make the pressure any less real.
I can't even begin to imagine how you would have any significant insight into the gay community. It's called the LGBT alliance for a reason.
You have a very poor imagination. I do have a number of gay friends. I pay attention to what they say, and most importantly what they say about their interactions with other gay friends of theirs. What Cody talks about is not unusual. It's nearly ubiquitous within the gay community. The only equivalent to the volume of pressure placed on gay's might be found in some fringe religious cults. It's that strong:
Codyy wrote:
There really are pressures, though. Not that I'm trying to agree with gbaji, but jesus christ do the supergays need to lay the hell off.
"Come to pride!"
"No. I don't like stuff like that."
"But it's gay!"
"Yeah?"
"You have to!"
"Really? You're wearing that? You can't be gay and wear that."
"Come to [insert any gay themed/gay related/event, club, or mass meeting with a target audience of homos here]!!!!!!!"
"Come to pride!"
"No. I don't like stuff like that."
"But it's gay!"
"Yeah?"
"You have to!"
"Really? You're wearing that? You can't be gay and wear that."
"Come to [insert any gay themed/gay related/event, club, or mass meeting with a target audience of homos here]!!!!!!!"
This exactly. I don't think there's a single gay person who hasn't experienced this. And that's not straight folks pressuring them to conform, it's their own "community". I understand why, but it's pretty clear that the need to be united in some kind of socio-political front has its negatives on the members of the group itself. Gay people can't just be gay and live otherwise normal lives.
Quote:
Then, if you decline, you're not gay enough for your gay peers because you don't go to all their gay events to gay it up with all the gay gays, they stop talking to you because you're just not that gay.
There's also the fact that as a gay male you're expected to be so stick thin that you're able to wear cheerios for bracelets and have 12" ***** with a six pack and wear jeans that you can't move in with bright colored tops and leather for sex. You also need to style and highlight your hair. Otherwise you're simply just not attractive and no one will ever love you. You should probably also own a mac and study graphic design, fashion, or hotel and restaurant management. You've also got to listen to Lady Gaga and have Ke$ha ringtones. It's also mandatory that you spell Ke$ha with a dollar sign.
Maybe I just need new gay friends. But these are the only ones I can find. /meltdown.
There's also the fact that as a gay male you're expected to be so stick thin that you're able to wear cheerios for bracelets and have 12" ***** with a six pack and wear jeans that you can't move in with bright colored tops and leather for sex. You also need to style and highlight your hair. Otherwise you're simply just not attractive and no one will ever love you. You should probably also own a mac and study graphic design, fashion, or hotel and restaurant management. You've also got to listen to Lady Gaga and have Ke$ha ringtones. It's also mandatory that you spell Ke$ha with a dollar sign.
Maybe I just need new gay friends. But these are the only ones I can find. /meltdown.
There are gays who aren't that obsessed with perfect appearance. In some ways they're scarier though. They're the pear shaped naked guys you see at Burning Man every year.
King Nobby wrote:
More words please
Codyy needs new gay friends.
Almalieque wrote:
As much as you like to believe otherwise, your claim about my attitude and approach is false.
Donate. One day it could be your family.
An invasion of armies can be resisted, but not an idea whose time has come. Victor Hugo
An invasion of armies can be resisted, but not an idea whose time has come. Victor Hugo
Almalieque wrote:
I only checked 3 pages out of a 37 page thread, but only noticed one person who agreed (Pensive). Everyone else, either disagreed or did not mention their opinion. Yet, now, people (who were present during the last debate) are openly stating their opinions. You still don't see any correlation?
Reading that it sounds like the two threads are the same... So what if people didn't mention their opinoin in the other thread but are in this thread...? Does that matter? Maybe they weren't sure then, but they have an opinion now.
You sound like a petulant child. "They wouldn't talk to ME, but they'll talk to BELKIRA. /pout"
He's just goading you guys into responding, as usual. If you ignore him, he'll post slightly less often.
Ugly wrote:
No, he's right about the approach being part of the issue. Like i said earlier, you may have tried to argue this, but in fact argued something else. You can never stay to the point you're trying to argue for or against. You always side track it into something ridiculous and that's where people begin to argue with you most often. Like now.
Nice try. The thread was about prop 8., it shifted (by the entire forum) to segregation (because proponents of SSM thinks there is similarity between SSM and racial discrimination). I countered that nonsense with the statement that while natural feelings are not choices, acting upon them are choices. Posters took that as "People choose to be gay" and that's where I argued for pages that a person's sexuality can change. The counter was that it can't change because doing so implies a choice of sexuality was made and sexuality isn't a choice.
No matter how you try to twist it, I adapted to the environment. I'm no different than many of you all, but you don't want to admit it.
Read below.
Quote:
Reading that it sounds like the two threads are the same... So what if people didn't mention their opinoin in the other thread but are in this thread...? Does that matter? Maybe they weren't sure then, but they have an opinion now.
You sound like a petulant child. "They wouldn't talk to ME, but they'll talk to BELKIRA. /pout"
Read above.
That post is an example. I'm just pointing out that we aren't that different, but people pretend to be so.
Spoon wrote:
He's just goading you guys into responding, as usual. If you ignore him, he'll post slightly less often.
That's actually the opposite of what I'm doing. I was avoiding this thread because I didn't want to get involved. That's why I'm just stating something I noticed and not going into rather you can or can't change your sexuality.
I'm currently in the process of studying for a really boring Windows certification during my short vacation in route to my next duty station...
Almalieque wrote:
That post is an example. I'm just pointing out that we aren't that different, but people pretend to be so.
No, you started out by stating that everyone is changing their opinion now and saying that people can change their orientation:
Almalieque wrote:
Back when someone told the story of a woman who was married with 4 children and then "realized" that she was a lesbian. I argued that she was probably straight (since I don't know her) and then became interested in women.
The counter was that you don't change, you just realize your real sexuality. I countered that to say, if you were just "confused" before you "realized" your real sexuality, then how does anyone know that you're just not "confused" now?
The bottom line is that it was a 20 pager about how that can't happen and when Belkira posts an article on a person who claims that he has done the same thing, everyone is like, "eh, I guess it can happen".
The counter was that you don't change, you just realize your real sexuality. I countered that to say, if you were just "confused" before you "realized" your real sexuality, then how does anyone know that you're just not "confused" now?
The bottom line is that it was a 20 pager about how that can't happen and when Belkira posts an article on a person who claims that he has done the same thing, everyone is like, "eh, I guess it can happen".
When it's pointed out to you that most people in this thread aren't saying that at all, you (as per your modus operandi) changed your argument.
Edited, Jun 21st 2011 1:58pm by Belkira
srsly ******* haet u guyz
Almalieque wrote:
Eske wrote:
I'm not seeing any correlation. You've got Belkira here, who seems skeptical. Kali, who didn't really address that issue, though did provide an anecdote that could explain a shifting opinion on it. And Coddy, who didn't talk about that.
I only checked 3 pages out of a 37 page thread, but only noticed one person who agreed (Pensive). Everyone else, either disagreed or did not mention their opinion. Yet, now, people (who were present during the last debate) are openly stating their opinions. You still don't see any correlation?
Nope, no correlation, insofar as any possible hypocrisy in particular poster's opinions between the two. Now, that's just going off the pages that you mentioned, of course.
I acknowledge that you get different responses from other people, though. And I even gave a reason for it before: you're an abrasive @#%^. Nobody enjoys your presence here, so you're more likely to get vitriol.
Almalieque wrote:
Eske wrote:
What's there to debate? It sucks, and he'll never be self-aware enough to truly consider that. End of story.
Since I'm not "self-aware" enough, why don't you educate me on how it sucks and is somehow different from any other poster here?
No.
Quote:
He's just goading you guys into responding, as usual. If you ignore him, he'll post slightly less often.
Tried that, but nobody else can demonstrate any restraint with him. Apparently he's an itch that someone's always going to scratch. Now I'm just skewing my responses more towards outward hate, instead of trying to appeal to the rational side that he doesn't possess.
Edited, Jun 21st 2011 3:01pm by Eske
NixNot wrote:
srsly @#%^ing haet u guyz
Spoonless the Silent wrote:
NixNot wrote:
srsly @#%^ing haet u gayz
George Carlin wrote:
I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately.
Belkira wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
That post is an example. I'm just pointing out that we aren't that different, but people pretend to be so.
No, you started out by stating that everyone is changing their opinion now and saying that people can change their orientation:
Almalieque wrote:
Back when someone told the story of a woman who was married with 4 children and then "realized" that she was a lesbian. I argued that she was probably straight (since I don't know her) and then became interested in women.
The counter was that you don't change, you just realize your real sexuality. I countered that to say, if you were just "confused" before you "realized" your real sexuality, then how does anyone know that you're just not "confused" now?
The bottom line is that it was a 20 pager about how that can't happen and when Belkira posts an article on a person who claims that he has done the same thing, everyone is like, "eh, I guess it can happen".
The counter was that you don't change, you just realize your real sexuality. I countered that to say, if you were just "confused" before you "realized" your real sexuality, then how does anyone know that you're just not "confused" now?
The bottom line is that it was a 20 pager about how that can't happen and when Belkira posts an article on a person who claims that he has done the same thing, everyone is like, "eh, I guess it can happen".
When it's pointed out to you that most people in this thread aren't saying that at all, you (as per your modus operandi) changed your argument.
Edited, Jun 21st 2011 1:58pm by Belkira
What?
Changing argument?
I said the following:
Almalieque wrote:
I only checked 3 pages out of a 37 page thread, but only noticed one person who agreed (Pensive). Everyone else, either disagreed or did not mention their opinion. Yet, now, people (who were present during the last debate) are openly stating their opinions. You still don't see any correlation?
Same exact argument.
I made a statement. People either disagreed or didn't say anything (except for Pensive). Now, people are more open to not only talk about it, but supporting my argument.
Same argument, it never changed.
-----------------
Eske, you need help. Obviously you have nothing against my "attitude" as it is no different than yours and everyone else on this forum.
Almalieque wrote:
I made a statement. People either disagreed or didn't say anything (except for Pensive). Now, people are more open to not only talk about it, but supporting my argument.
Same argument, it never changed.
Same argument, it never changed.
Please show me an exact example of someone posting in this thread with a different opinion than the other thread. From what I'm reading, no one is saying anything different than the thread you are referencing.
As for the "changing your argument" bit, that was my mistake, I misread your first post here, sorry.
Almalieque wrote:
Eske, you need help. Obviously you have nothing against my "attitude" as it is no different than yours and everyone else on this forum.
Whatever you say, kiddo.
_____ __ _
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| | | _| | | | |/ _ \| | | | / __| __/ _ \| '_ \
_| |_| | | |_| | (_) | |_| | \__ \ || (_) | |_) |
|_____|_| \__, |\___/ \__,_| |___/\__\___/| .__/
__/ | | |
|___/ |_|
_ _ _
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_ __ ___ ___ _ __ ___ _ __ __| |_ _ __ __ _ | |__ ___
| '__/ _ \/ __| '_ \ / _ \| '_ \ / _` | | '_ \ / _` | | '_ \ / _ \
| | | __/\__ \ |_) | (_) | | | | (_| | | | | | (_| | | | | | __/
|_| \___||___/ .__/ \___/|_| |_|\__,_|_|_| |_|\__, | |_| |_|\___|
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_ _ _ _ _ _
(_) | | | | | | (_)
__ ___| | | ___| |_ ___ _ __ _ __ ___ ___| |_ _ _ __ __ _
\ \ /\ / / | | | / __| __/ _ \| '_ \ | '_ \ / _ \/ __| __| | '_ \ / _` |
\ V V /| | | | \__ \ || (_) | |_) | | |_) | (_) \__ \ |_| | | | | (_| |
\_/\_/ |_|_|_| |___/\__\___/| .__/ | .__/ \___/|___/\__|_|_| |_|\__, |
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|_| |_| |___/
NixNot wrote:
_____ __ _
|_ _|/ _| | |
| | | |_ _ _ ___ _ _ ___| |_ ___ _ __
| | | _| | | | |/ _ \| | | | / __| __/ _ \| '_ \
_| |_| | | |_| | (_) | |_| | \__ \ || (_) | |_) |
|_____|_| \__, |\___/ \__,_| |___/\__\___/| .__/
__/ | | |
|___/ |_|
_ _ _
| (_) | |
_ __ ___ ___ _ __ ___ _ __ __| |_ _ __ __ _ | |__ ___
| '__/ _ \/ __| '_ \ / _ \| '_ \ / _` | | '_ \ / _` | | '_ \ / _ \
| | | __/\__ \ |_) | (_) | | | | (_| | | | | | (_| | | | | | __/
|_| \___||___/ .__/ \___/|_| |_|\__,_|_|_| |_|\__, | |_| |_|\___|
| | __/ |
|_| |___/
_ _ _ _ _ _
(_) | | | | | | (_)
__ ___| | | ___| |_ ___ _ __ _ __ ___ ___| |_ _ _ __ __ _
\ \ /\ / / | | | / __| __/ _ \| '_ \ | '_ \ / _ \/ __| __| | '_ \ / _` |
\ V V /| | | | \__ \ || (_) | |_) | | |_) | (_) \__ \ |_| | | | | (_| |
\_/\_/ |_|_|_| |___/\__\___/| .__/ | .__/ \___/|___/\__|_|_| |_|\__, |
| | | | __/ |
|_| |_| |___/
Wasn't he an OoT poster before infecting =4? I think if he was created here, then its you guys' job to destroy him.
Quote:
I can't even begin to imagine how you would have any significant insight into the gay community. It's called the LGBT alliance for a reason.
Yeah, there's a reason - the name didn't just apply itself in some grand miracle - but it isn't that it represents some perfect, immutable truth. There are plenty of gay people that are anti-bi or anti-trans, and vice versa. It's not a wholly unified community by any means.
Belkira wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
I made a statement. People either disagreed or didn't say anything (except for Pensive). Now, people are more open to not only talk about it, but supporting my argument.
Same argument, it never changed.
Same argument, it never changed.
Please show me an exact example of someone posting in this thread with a different opinion than the other thread. From what I'm reading, no one is saying anything different than the thread you are referencing.
As for the "changing your argument" bit, that was my mistake, I misread your first post here, sorry.
I focused on the bold for a reason. I think you're misunderstanding what I'm saying in that quote.
Quote:
Nice try.
Donate. One day it could be your family.
An invasion of armies can be resisted, but not an idea whose time has come. Victor Hugo
An invasion of armies can be resisted, but not an idea whose time has come. Victor Hugo
Almalieque wrote:
Belkira wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
I made a statement. People either disagreed or didn't say anything (except for Pensive). Now, people are more open to not only talk about it, but supporting my argument.
Same argument, it never changed.
Same argument, it never changed.
Please show me an exact example of someone posting in this thread with a different opinion than the other thread. From what I'm reading, no one is saying anything different than the thread you are referencing.
As for the "changing your argument" bit, that was my mistake, I misread your first post here, sorry.
I focused on the bold for a reason. I think you're misunderstanding what I'm saying in that quote.
So... who's supporting your argument, then?
Other than that, I was right in my first post to you. You're just being a petulent child, crying because the other kids in the sandbox won't talk to you, but they'll talk to someone else.
#50Almalieque,
Posted: Jun 21 2011 at 2:24 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Eske: What's there to debate? It sucks, and he'll never be self-aware enough to truly consider that. End of story.
NixNot wrote:
Codyy needs new gay friends.
Most of my friends are straight. I'll ocassionally get a little McRibbing (that's for you, Nix) for being gay, but it never goes any farther than "Oh Green Lantern has Ryan Reynolds in spandex, I bet I know who's going to see that movie!"
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