Forum Settings
       
Reply To Thread

What are the rules on rate-ups exactly?Follow

#27 Aug 10 2007 at 11:53 AM Rating: Decent
***
2,793 posts
Quote:
I posted in that ding thread and wrote what I did for the ironic value of it. I personally hate threads like that, and was simply pointing out the violence inherent in the system, or something.

Besides, I don't have to ***** for karma, I get rated up all the time because my every post drips with a special something awesome that everyone can get behind, like a congo line at a nude gay bar.

Anyway, don't use me as an example of what's wrong with karma. I started posting in the Asylum, notoriously the roughest forum on this site as far as a newb's karma goes, and that's where I got my nifty sage title, again, because I kick ***.

I love karma threads, by the way, there should be way more of them in this forum.


I'm talking about (mis) perception. Thought I was pretty clear. ..Try try again.. See your base karma is high enough that 1 rate up puts it excellent. Newbie comes in see excellent, presumes circle jerk due to said content. I popped over to forum 28 picked a thread at random and picked 2 posts at random. It's not personal.
____________________________

#28 Aug 10 2007 at 12:02 PM Rating: Excellent
Mistress of Gardening
Avatar
*****
14,661 posts
I don't rate up very often, but must confess that BT gets a rather high percentage of them for making me lol at work. I'll probably have to ban him when he gets me fired for cracking up at his comments though.
____________________________
Yum-Yum Bento Box | Pikko Pots | Adventures in Bentomaking

Twitter


[ffxivsig]277809[/ffxivsig]
#29 Aug 10 2007 at 12:03 PM Rating: Good
thatdamnelf wrote:

I'm talking about (mis) perception. Thought I was pretty clear. ..Try try again.. See your base karma is high enough that 1 rate up puts it excellent. Newbie comes in see excellent, presumes circle jerk due to said content. I popped over to forum 28 picked a thread at random and picked 2 posts at random. It's not personal.


Ahh, it's just a funny cosmic coincidence then that you actually did pick a thread that was nothing more than a CJ. Now that's funny. I guess, though, you know what they say, "Drop a **** or a midget in the OoT and it's bound to land on a CJ".
#30 Aug 10 2007 at 3:22 PM Rating: Default
****
4,906 posts
Since the purpose of this thread is obviously about the WAR forums. And I don't look through every thread and clearly missed the one with the admins posting. It was only brought to my attention in game by a few people.

I should confess, I was the first to start it. If you really love to do so, you can go look through the old threads and posts, and see me whine that I want my name, REDshift, in RED. Then lolgaxe followed. Do I care for karma? No, because karma is a joke on the forums; I just wanted it RED, that's all. Also, if you care to look at Eltio's karma history. I was the first to rate him down, if that matters.

So the problem is PEOPLE abused your karma system... First mistake, you trust PEOPLE. PEOPLE never learn from previous mistakes and you should never expect anything posivite. Second mistake, instead of whining that PEOPLE don't do what you never told them not to do, maybe... gasp... you should put some limits to the karma system and make a public note of it? And then punish those involved? God forbid you limit it to five or ten rate up/down each day per user or something. Or even something along the lines of, one user cannot receive more than 10 rate up/down per day. That would be the most sensible thing to do, wouldn't it?

People these days...
#31 Aug 10 2007 at 3:39 PM Rating: Excellent
Avatar
******
29,919 posts
RedshiftOnPandy wrote:
No, because karma is a joke on the forums;


Why is it always the whiney ones that insist the system is a joke?
____________________________
Arch Duke Kaolian Drachensborn, lvl 95 Ranger, Unrest Server
Tech support forum | FAQ (Support) | Mobile Zam: http://m.zam.com (Premium only)
Forum Rules
#32 Aug 10 2007 at 3:45 PM Rating: Decent
@#%^ing DRK
*****
13,143 posts
Rime wrote:
Which OOT are you lurking? If 3 months ago I was at 3.28 compared to my 3.20 now. Obviously that "+1 CJing" isn't happening in the OOT I've been posting in for the better part of 3 years.


I think you're just a special case.
#33 Aug 10 2007 at 4:41 PM Rating: Good
Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:
Why is it always the whiney ones that insist the system is a joke?


Why is it no one can respond to the request to put the guidelines that you follow in print somewhere or at least spell out what kind of behavior is unacceptable in the FAQ?

Is it because you can't answer that contractually, then just say that. Or is it really because despite the "Guidelines" and impartiality, it isn't really consistency between admins and between forums?

Obviously Pikko and Kaolain deal with things vastly diferent. We've been told numerous times how lucky we are that Pikko found it first. So clearly there is at least one inconsistency there.

And seriously you might not think of Karma as a joke, but the war forums has never really taken it too serious. We've never needed pretty colors to figure out who was wasting electrons and who had something worth saying. This whole thing started because of that additude. It got out of control when we realized how amazingly simple it was to get people to higher ranks.

What has people in the War forums upset is not their Karma or that they got norated but the fact that a rule that is not clearly stated anywhere, was enforced with minimal warning on them. It's akin to having a Speed limit posted by word of mouth then getting a ticket for 15 over.
#34 Aug 10 2007 at 4:50 PM Rating: Default
****
4,906 posts
Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:
RedshiftOnPandy wrote:
No, because karma is a joke on the forums;


Why is it always the whiney ones that insist the system is a joke?
Whiny? Don't take it personally, but maybe my expectations from admins are too high in regards to user replies, but I expected more than a shallow insult.

You know the system doesn't work and your current methods of spike flailing rate up threads and norating aren't doing anything to change that. So... Reason would foretell to use a different approach if your method sucks and isn't productive. At least I gave ideas; put limits on it. All you can come up with is norating people.
#35 Aug 10 2007 at 5:12 PM Rating: Excellent
Avatar
******
29,919 posts
Putting limit counters on everyones raes would add so much overhead to the servers that the site would probably grind to an intant halt.

You rated single person 160 times in a single day. Perhaps my "sucky" method of warning you that it if it ever happens again you will be norated and karma bombed back into the stone age doesn't seem to work well to you, but I find it is highly effective in resolving trouble spots.

The karma system is working as intended. Anomalies will be adjudicated. Resistance is Futile.
____________________________
Arch Duke Kaolian Drachensborn, lvl 95 Ranger, Unrest Server
Tech support forum | FAQ (Support) | Mobile Zam: http://m.zam.com (Premium only)
Forum Rules
#37 Aug 10 2007 at 5:14 PM Rating: Excellent
Avatar
******
29,919 posts
Losttroll wrote:
Why is it no one can respond to the request to put the guidelines that you follow in print somewhere or at least spell out what kind of behavior is unacceptable in the FAQ?
.


It is in the faq. "Don't abuse the system" If you think you might be abusing the system you probably are.
____________________________
Arch Duke Kaolian Drachensborn, lvl 95 Ranger, Unrest Server
Tech support forum | FAQ (Support) | Mobile Zam: http://m.zam.com (Premium only)
Forum Rules
#38 Aug 10 2007 at 5:17 PM Rating: Excellent
Are you guys ******** because you got caught having a circle jerk and Pikko knocked you down for it? Is your argument that the karma system is a joke and you don't care about it? Do you choke yourself when you ********** to moogles? Do you then go on about how there should be warnings posted about what is breaking the karma rules? Are you children, incapable of drawing the conclusion that on a user-moderated forum the rating of posts is the barometer by which we can tell whether or not you suck? Can you not therefore cocnlude that you shouldn't abuse that system one way or the other, not out of fear of punishment but just because you aren't a total moron? Do your eyes water in rage just reading this? Want to tell me to go away? Do you need someone to hold your hand all the time and whisper the right way to behave in your stupid little ear? What kind of a self-centered *** do you have to be to recommend the site overhaul it's system because you got caught abusing it?

Can I make this any more clear? Shut up and crawl back into your clubhouse.
#39 Aug 10 2007 at 9:30 PM Rating: Decent
Gee BT, I would almost be crushed by your verbal abuse except for one little issue:

I didn't go nuts on Karma, I didn't get slapped down for it, and I still think that it could be a hell of alot more clear. Last I checked there is no minimum age for alla, so assumeing everyone is at your superior maturity level is probably being overly optismistic.

Since I couldn't actually give a damn what you and your club house thinks of me and mine, and since this is the Feedback forums don't mind if I ignore pretty much everything you say from here on out though since I am pretty sure your powers as an admin are pretty much right up there with none and I am actually trying to have a civil discussion with someone who is an admin and give them some user feedback.



For the record Kaolian, I did look through the FAQ linked on the FFXI Menu bar and "Don't Abuse the System" is not on there anywhere nor is anything even remotely close to it. However I just remember that The Smileys Help had some Karma info on it.

This:
    Rating guidelines: How and why you rate a post is your concern, however we ask that you keep a few things in mind. If you find yourself rating entire threads up or down, or following specific posters around and rating all of their posts one way, this is considered Karma camping, and is actively discouraged. Also, creating a secondary forum account for the sole purpose of buffering your own karma is considered cheating.


is exactly what I was looking for and as far as I can find the only way to get to this information is by clicking on "Markup Help" or "Smileys Help" when posting a message and then scrolling down a bit. If it is linked somewhere other than that I apologize, but I can't find it, and I would venture to say that those two headers are not where people would look to find rules.
#40 Aug 10 2007 at 10:27 PM Rating: Good
Oh come off it. At least admit you're upset because your hijynx got put to an end. I mean, this:

Quote:
And seriously you might not think of Karma as a joke, but the war forums has never really taken it too serious. We've never needed pretty colors to figure out who was wasting electrons and who had something worth saying. This whole thing started because of that additude. It got out of control when we realized how amazingly simple it was to get people to higher ranks.

What has people in the War forums upset is not their Karma or that they got norated but the fact that a rule that is not clearly stated anywhere, was enforced with minimal warning on them. It's akin to having a Speed limit posted by word of mouth then getting a ticket for 15 over.


doesn't sound like someone who doesn't care. I mean, check this out, it's mind-blowing: you just compared being no-rated and having karma penalized with getting a speeding ticket. There's a difference here, unless you don't really give a hoot about your financial losses from speeding tickets.

You do care about losing rating abilities. You do care about getting spanked. Otherwise you wouldn't be making this plea for a more clear explanation of the rules. The whole thing is really just misdirected angst placed at the lack of clear and present warnings when really you're just pissed you got caught.

And I'm not talking just to you, whoever I just quoted, I'm talking to all of you who are crying in this thread. Just buck up and move on. You've learned your lesson, right?

You've learned your lesson, and it's one that shouldn't really need learning. It's a lesson that if any of you were being sincere you would admit you knew, because it's obvious that rating people hundreds of times a day is ridiculous.
#41Deadgye, Posted: Aug 10 2007 at 11:36 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Get me to sage then, przu.
#42 Aug 11 2007 at 7:25 AM Rating: Decent
Ghost in the Machine
Avatar
******
36,443 posts
I rate Barkingturtle up because I have a huge eCrush on him. I rate Kaolian down because I'm fighting the man!

Kaolian wrote:
Why is it always the whiney ones that insist the system is a joke?


The system is a joke.

No, seriously, it is. It's fun, I guess, but it's still a joke. Don't get me wrong here, I'm not ********* I'm sitting on 18-no-life-and-no-*****-thousand posts with a 3.26 karma rating. I'm not going anywhere unless Kao goes on a rampage (note to self: purchase premium immediately after writing this thread) or Judgement Day comes knocking on the door. Karma is just a thing I can look and giggle at. I see the idiots get rated to sub-default and the smartmouths usually get rated to sage or guru if their vocabulary and IQ is sufficient.

The point is, it doesn't change anything. The idiots will just keep posting and make new accounts until they get bansmacked. Banning negates the point of the karma system (user moderation) since users can't ban other users (yet). The gurus are usually sitting on a couple of thousand posts and they're popular enough to never go below the filter, unless they really **** up, in which case the above mentioned scenario takes over. Let's face it, above default and it doesn't really matter what ******* color your name is in. The colors only play a role ePeen-wise and for prejudice (gurus must be popular, hence their posts must, per definition, be awesome).

I thought about actively rating people down a lot a while back, but came to the conclusion that some ****** out there might just do the opposite of what I'm doing, making my ratings worthless. I even have the filter set to "never" so I don't miss out on the sub-default posts. There are some good laughs to be found in those once in a while.

Anyways, just thought I'd chime in. Go karma, go.

Ps. Just to cover all bases, why have so many asylumites turned guru?
____________________________
Please "talk up" if your comprehension white-shifts. I will use simple-happy language-words to help you understand.
#43 Aug 11 2007 at 7:39 AM Rating: Decent
****
4,136 posts
Losttroll wrote:
Quote:
If you are rateing every post in a thread, especially if it is a long thread, up or down, You might be karma camping. The decision is based on an admin review, and we generally take into account the tone of the thread, your past rating history, any user complaints we recieve, and how often such things happen.

If you are following a specific user around and rateing every post they make up or down, you might be karma camping. The decision is based on an admin review of your rating history, their rating history on you (if any), the tone of recent posts you and they made, and if they or you did anything particularily offensive in their posts. If two people want to karm camp each other into pblivion, well that's fine with me.

As a side note, if you are karma camping someone and they start karma camping you (since there are ways to figure that using recent visitors and who has rate ability) DO NOT ask me to investigate karma camping on you. I will check your rating history as well. You would be suprised how often this comes up.


And finally, if you post in a thread with content similar to "hey, post in here and i'll rate you up if you rate me up" we will find it, and we will smite you with unbridled fury. Complaining about said smiteing after the fact is likely to irritate me, and if you are going to complain, I might as well really give you something to complain about if you catch my drift...

Any questions?


Something along these lines should be in the FAQ.
Honestly, all that can be summed up in a much shorter line: "Don't abuse the karma system. You know when you are." ... Seriously, you know when you're abusing the system, or you should know. You shouldn't need it all spelled out for you. We're all "adults" (used very loosely) here. We know when we're having an orgy of rate ups that that's not how the system was intended...

If you understand the purpose of karma, which I think is pretty clearly spelled out, then you should know what actions go against or ignore that purpose.



Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:
Losttroll wrote:
Why is it no one can respond to the request to put the guidelines that you follow in print somewhere or at least spell out what kind of behavior is unacceptable in the FAQ?
.


It is in the faq. "Don't abuse the system" If you think you might be abusing the system you probably are.
Exactly.
#44 Aug 11 2007 at 8:33 AM Rating: Excellent
Avatar
******
29,919 posts
Mazra wrote:

Ps. Just to cover all bases, why have so many asylumites turned guru?


Mazra proves my argument. I rest my case.

Why are so many Asylumites guru? For one thing they have been here a heck of alot longer than many of you. They were active in the current forum system during much of the beta testing phase, and were therefore exposed to the karma system early, plus they had larger post counts overall compared to most of the other sections, which generally has a tendancy for others to rate their posts up ive noticed. Most of the asylumites that have guru had it before I became an admin. I did move a few of them afterwords that I felt deserved it, but I have also moved a few OOTers, FFXIers, Wow posters, etc. I have also moved down people in all sections who have abused the system.

So basically the asylumites are Gurus because they are better than you and you smell funny.
____________________________
Arch Duke Kaolian Drachensborn, lvl 95 Ranger, Unrest Server
Tech support forum | FAQ (Support) | Mobile Zam: http://m.zam.com (Premium only)
Forum Rules
#45 Aug 11 2007 at 8:35 AM Rating: Excellent
Avatar
******
29,919 posts
Losttroll wrote:

For the record Kaolian, I did look through the FAQ linked on the FFXI Menu bar and "Don't Abuse the System" is not on there anywhere nor is anything even remotely close to it. However I just remember that The Smileys Help had some Karma info on it.
.


That IS the forum faq. I wrote it.
____________________________
Arch Duke Kaolian Drachensborn, lvl 95 Ranger, Unrest Server
Tech support forum | FAQ (Support) | Mobile Zam: http://m.zam.com (Premium only)
Forum Rules
#46 Aug 11 2007 at 9:13 AM Rating: Excellent
The smiley help is the forum FAQ or the other menu one?

If you are talking about the Menu FAQ I just searched it again and still don't see anything about abuse.

If you are talking about the one in the smileys links, then it is there, and it is specifc and clear, but I would think a general link to it titled "Forum Rules & Help" would get more attention for those seeking rules then having it only linked under Markup Help and Smileys Help, neither of which suggest that rules would be found there, and since I believe only premium users get smileys, free users would probably never use that link.

Again if it is directly linked somewhere else, I apologize, but having used this site for over 3 years now, I have never seen such a link.
#47 Aug 11 2007 at 9:58 AM Rating: Decent
Quote:
I apologize, but having used this site for over 3 years now, I have never seen such a link.



Uh, no you haven't. I know this mostly because my user number is lower than yours, and I haven't been around 3 years quite yet.
#48 Aug 11 2007 at 11:19 AM Rating: Decent
Vagina Dentata,
what a wonderful phrase
******
30,106 posts
Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:
RedshiftOnPandy wrote:
No, because karma is a joke on the forums;


Why is it always the whiney ones that insist the system is a joke?


Because they take it all too personally.

Quote:

So basically the asylumites are Gurus because they are better than you and you smell funny.


All asylumites smell like limburger. Smiley: mad

Edited, Aug 11th 2007 3:23pm by Annabella
____________________________
Turin wrote:
Seriously, what the f*ck nature?
#49 Aug 11 2007 at 11:29 AM Rating: Good
Quote:
Uh, no you haven't. I know this mostly because my user number is lower than yours, and I haven't been around 3 years quite yet.


Or I had another account prior to this one, that I lost the password on when I upgraded a PC. I started using this one about 2.5 years ago.
#50 Aug 11 2007 at 1:26 PM Rating: Excellent
Avatar
******
29,919 posts
yoiu know we can retrieve old accounts. The only one i see on anyof your prior IPs is smaller than that one though now
____________________________
Arch Duke Kaolian Drachensborn, lvl 95 Ranger, Unrest Server
Tech support forum | FAQ (Support) | Mobile Zam: http://m.zam.com (Premium only)
Forum Rules
#51 Aug 11 2007 at 1:33 PM Rating: Good
Ghost in the Machine
Avatar
******
36,443 posts
Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:
So basically the asylumites are Gurus because they are better than you and you smell funny.

If the Asylum and OOT forums are supposed to be the cream of the crop then I seriously hope your boss has a backup plan.

What I'm trying to get at here is that the karma rating doesn't show a poster's true value to the site. If I posted exclusively in the WoW or OOT forum, I'd probably be Sage or Guru by now. I'm not, mainly because a certain forum hates me (cry cry). Does it bother me that I see people gaining Guru in a matter of weeks by making vulgar jokes about new posters and stuff? Well, no, it doesn't. My rate-up/-down is just as good as theirs, right? What does bother me is that Gurus from the Asylum and the OOT can go to a game board and be a complete prick without having to worry about the consequences. New posters/readers will visit the site, see a Guru post something stupid and think "Gee, if they're the cream of the crop then someone ****** up big time."

I've seen it happen many times. It's not good business.

Meh, talking to a brick wall, etc. Karma doesn't matter, etc. Well, if it doesn't matter, why is it there? Just curious, because I think the site would run a hell of a lot faster without the calculations going on with the rating system.

I could go on all night about why the system is flawed, but brick wall and stuff.
____________________________
Please "talk up" if your comprehension white-shifts. I will use simple-happy language-words to help you understand.
Reply To Thread

Colors Smileys Quote OriginalQuote Checked Help

 

Recent Visitors: 128 All times are in CST
Anonymous Guests (128)