http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/db/jobs.html?fjob=18;mid=1215630637240712715;num=19;page=1
In trying to contribute to the forum, I have run into an individual that refuses to contribute in any significant manner to the thread, yet at the same time takes painfully huge amounts of effort to seriously offended and belittle me.
I have broad shoulders and can take quite a bit of verbal abuse. But I think this has gotten way out of line and ask you for assistance.
Alternatively, if this type of behavior and language is in fact sanctioned and approved by Allakhazam, if this is the type of person that you prefer to have as members, please confirm and I will deal with on my end as needed.
Please assist and thank you in advance.
Edited title to try to get an admin's attention and assistance
Edited, Jul 11th 2008 9:24pm by RaiseIII
Edited, Jul 12th 2008 12:10pm by Darqflame
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#2
Jul 11 2008 at 12:14 PM
RaiseIII wrote:
http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/db/jobs.html?fjob=18;mid=1215630637240712715;num=19;page=1
In trying to contribute to the forum, I have run into an individual that refuses to contribute in any significant manner to the thread, yet at the same time takes painfully huge amounts of effort to seriously offended and belittle me.
I have broad shoulders and can take quite a bit of verbal abuse. But I think this has gotten way out of line and ask you for assistance.
Alternatively, if this type of behavior and language is in fact sanctioned and approved by Allakhazam, if this is the type of person that you prefer to have as members, please confirm and I will deal with on my end as needed.
Please assist and thank you in advance.
In trying to contribute to the forum, I have run into an individual that refuses to contribute in any significant manner to the thread, yet at the same time takes painfully huge amounts of effort to seriously offended and belittle me.
I have broad shoulders and can take quite a bit of verbal abuse. But I think this has gotten way out of line and ask you for assistance.
Alternatively, if this type of behavior and language is in fact sanctioned and approved by Allakhazam, if this is the type of person that you prefer to have as members, please confirm and I will deal with on my end as needed.
Please assist and thank you in advance.
Oh quit being a douche. He wasn't rude or nasty in his reply. You got offended that he did not agree with you so you called him out and called him rude and stupid. Your fault. Please DIAF.
#3REDACTED,
Posted: Jul 11 2008 at 12:16 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Well I read it too, and while he made a lot of valid points, he DOES have a potty mouth lol.
#4
Jul 11 2008 at 12:34 PM
If he would have made a civil argument I would have more than happily debated it and dealt with it.
A good debate has absolutely none of the derogatory, inflammatory and offensive language that he used.
If George Carlin says you can't use it on TV, then it would seem that those are words you shouldn't use in a public discussion let alone a debate. I fully understand one or two here or there,it happens. I even let a couple of the responses go by without saying a thing. But in the end, he was abusive and exceeded anything that could be remotely considered reasonable let alone respectable by a far stretch.
I had a civil, informative helpful thread going and he jumped in there and right off the bat tried to incite a riot. I will not be intimidated by you , him or anyone else and I am trying to understand if people like him using language like he did in that thread is acceptable to Alakhazam.
Should the rest of the folks that frequent this wonderful source of information be subject to any concern of verbal abuse each and every time they think about posting a question or comment? Common sense is one thing. An honest question or comment another. But that was offensive.
If it is typical of what Alla uses to sell their advertising dollars and support themselves and loyal gamers like us, and typical of what they want these forums to be filled with...then as I said before, I will deal with it on my end.
A good debate has absolutely none of the derogatory, inflammatory and offensive language that he used.
If George Carlin says you can't use it on TV, then it would seem that those are words you shouldn't use in a public discussion let alone a debate. I fully understand one or two here or there,it happens. I even let a couple of the responses go by without saying a thing. But in the end, he was abusive and exceeded anything that could be remotely considered reasonable let alone respectable by a far stretch.
I had a civil, informative helpful thread going and he jumped in there and right off the bat tried to incite a riot. I will not be intimidated by you , him or anyone else and I am trying to understand if people like him using language like he did in that thread is acceptable to Alakhazam.
Should the rest of the folks that frequent this wonderful source of information be subject to any concern of verbal abuse each and every time they think about posting a question or comment? Common sense is one thing. An honest question or comment another. But that was offensive.
If it is typical of what Alla uses to sell their advertising dollars and support themselves and loyal gamers like us, and typical of what they want these forums to be filled with...then as I said before, I will deal with it on my end.
#5
Jul 11 2008 at 12:37 PM
RaiseIII wrote:
/Insert :Much whining and complaining trying to act like he didnt start the argument and then get called on it.
He replied nicely and used no such inflammatory remarks as you are referring to in his first post. You called him out and started the fight. He retaliated to your rudeness. Seriously, quit being such a tight *** and learn to deal with other peoples differing views.
Nate's first reply
Quote:
Three mobs is no good. Even when I finally got 5-8 orcs lined up, the skillup rate was pretty terrible. If you're serious about this, you're going to spend days here skilling up, dealing with the idiot gil farmers, not enough MNK orcs, bad skillups, and whatever else can go wrong. Orcs also have this wonderful knockback move that's probably going to **** you off, by repositioning all the orcs. This "ideal" skillup spot quickly becomes a nightmare.
Keep in mind that these "guides" are not an exact science, by any stretch of the imagination. If you fight weaker mobs, you evade more. This becomes a serious problem, because if they can't hit you then you can't guard at all. Sometimes when you're specifically targeting weaker mobs for the "sweet spot", you're shooting yourself in the foot. You're going to need ten times as many mobs just to get them to hit you enough to make your time worthwhile. I think you should stop targeting mobs if you can't get enough to dent your HP.
Basically, your skill up rate is going to be crappy whether you target mobs or not. So if it's going to be crappy, you may as well be targeting something much less stressful, like just farming high-level mobs or whatever. If you're really hell-bent on it, you could try chigoes. The skill up rate will be equally as terrible, but a thousand times less stressful.
You need to spend a few days there yourself and tell me how many skill ups you get and how many hairs you lost. I suggest you skip straight to Purgonorgo Isle until you hit 100ish, then kinda forget the idea entirely. I think the "sweet spot" for orcs was around 120. Around 130+ you're just screwed.
I'm not even sure what levels the different mandragora mobs in the boyahda tree were good for. I tried them every 10-20 levels and they were always terrible for me. The pucks in the den of rancor were terrible too, until I hit around 230 skill. From what I could tell, the skill up ranges on mobs are **** as hell.
Raise III wrote:
So, just how long will it take? Forever and a day. It takes a loooong time. Once you hit 200 skill, be happy with .1-.4 per RL hour day. Ya, it's nuts
This is what it's like from 130-200. It gets far worse 200+. Eventually it's so bad that you start to think you're capped on the mob, when you aren't yet. You try fighting something harder for a few hours, still with no skillups. You go back to weaker mobs for a few hours, still with no skillups. If someone has had better experiences, you should write down your exact level range and mob, because it seemed like absolutely nowhere ever worked for me.
EDIT: The only really viable option IMO is to have someone cast phalanx on you while you tank a crapload of slightly harder mobs (I'm talking 20+), like the white mandragoras in the tree. That's a thousand times more practical than anything you could try in those guarding videos.
A comment on Genome's video:
I think he made a mistake when using chigoes for his demonstration. Chigoes don't actually attack that fast all the time. What you're witnessing is a lot of clips he took of triple attacks (chigoes are a THF mob). I'm not totally sure about this, but I have a theory about guards and chigoes. It seems like whenever a chigoe triple attacks and a guard procs, all three hits of the triple attack are guarded.
If my observation is true, then it explains what's going on in the video. In one portion of the video you see 4-5 triple attacks in a row. He happens to guard them all, making it look like he guarded dozens of hits in a row, when he only truly guarded 4-5 in a row. Even if you had a 25% guard rate, the chances of getting 9+ guards in a row is 1 out of 250,000. The chances of getting 3 triple attacks guarded would only be 1 out of 64.
Also, the damage you take probably has no effect on spell interruption. I don't know why he found it surprising that stoneskin was interrupted, as you can get a cast interrupt on a 1 damage hit. Cast interrupt is also based on your enhancing skill for stoneskin. It's the same reason /NIN jobs can never get utsusemi off; it's because the subjobbed ninjutsu skill is dictating the cast interrupt rate. A MNK/RDM obviously has no chance of getting a stoneskin off, unless the hits are evaded/countered.
Keep in mind that these "guides" are not an exact science, by any stretch of the imagination. If you fight weaker mobs, you evade more. This becomes a serious problem, because if they can't hit you then you can't guard at all. Sometimes when you're specifically targeting weaker mobs for the "sweet spot", you're shooting yourself in the foot. You're going to need ten times as many mobs just to get them to hit you enough to make your time worthwhile. I think you should stop targeting mobs if you can't get enough to dent your HP.
Basically, your skill up rate is going to be crappy whether you target mobs or not. So if it's going to be crappy, you may as well be targeting something much less stressful, like just farming high-level mobs or whatever. If you're really hell-bent on it, you could try chigoes. The skill up rate will be equally as terrible, but a thousand times less stressful.
You need to spend a few days there yourself and tell me how many skill ups you get and how many hairs you lost. I suggest you skip straight to Purgonorgo Isle until you hit 100ish, then kinda forget the idea entirely. I think the "sweet spot" for orcs was around 120. Around 130+ you're just screwed.
I'm not even sure what levels the different mandragora mobs in the boyahda tree were good for. I tried them every 10-20 levels and they were always terrible for me. The pucks in the den of rancor were terrible too, until I hit around 230 skill. From what I could tell, the skill up ranges on mobs are **** as hell.
Raise III wrote:
So, just how long will it take? Forever and a day. It takes a loooong time. Once you hit 200 skill, be happy with .1-.4 per RL hour day. Ya, it's nuts
This is what it's like from 130-200. It gets far worse 200+. Eventually it's so bad that you start to think you're capped on the mob, when you aren't yet. You try fighting something harder for a few hours, still with no skillups. You go back to weaker mobs for a few hours, still with no skillups. If someone has had better experiences, you should write down your exact level range and mob, because it seemed like absolutely nowhere ever worked for me.
EDIT: The only really viable option IMO is to have someone cast phalanx on you while you tank a crapload of slightly harder mobs (I'm talking 20+), like the white mandragoras in the tree. That's a thousand times more practical than anything you could try in those guarding videos.
A comment on Genome's video:
I think he made a mistake when using chigoes for his demonstration. Chigoes don't actually attack that fast all the time. What you're witnessing is a lot of clips he took of triple attacks (chigoes are a THF mob). I'm not totally sure about this, but I have a theory about guards and chigoes. It seems like whenever a chigoe triple attacks and a guard procs, all three hits of the triple attack are guarded.
If my observation is true, then it explains what's going on in the video. In one portion of the video you see 4-5 triple attacks in a row. He happens to guard them all, making it look like he guarded dozens of hits in a row, when he only truly guarded 4-5 in a row. Even if you had a 25% guard rate, the chances of getting 9+ guards in a row is 1 out of 250,000. The chances of getting 3 triple attacks guarded would only be 1 out of 64.
Also, the damage you take probably has no effect on spell interruption. I don't know why he found it surprising that stoneskin was interrupted, as you can get a cast interrupt on a 1 damage hit. Cast interrupt is also based on your enhancing skill for stoneskin. It's the same reason /NIN jobs can never get utsusemi off; it's because the subjobbed ninjutsu skill is dictating the cast interrupt rate. A MNK/RDM obviously has no chance of getting a stoneskin off, unless the hits are evaded/countered.
See, no bad words, no pointing fingers, none of the accused rudeness.
Edited, Jul 11th 2008 3:41pm by Katie
#6
Jul 11 2008 at 2:43 PM
Having read the thread, I ahve to say his first reply is actually very polite, with no insults, no rudeness, and nothing offensive . If you'd replied in the same tone, I dont think the situation would have escalated. I'm sure you tried to be polite, but your response to Nateypoos first , polite reply, came over as patronising and arrogant .
I didn't see anything negative about his initial reply,he simply stated his experience of the matter - and everyones experience is different. For example, if two people buy the ffxi starter pack and play for 30 days, one likes it and stays, one hates it and leaves - neither is wrong, they simply had different experiences and perceptions of the game.
If everyone shared the same opinion, there would never be any need for discussion forums at all :P
While his second reply did come across as rude, its possible that he misinterpreted what you said. You hardly did anything to cool the situation by continueing to respond, and being just as insulting (with less swearing admittedly) as he was.
Really, its a case of pot-calling-kettle. You can't complain of someone behaving in a certain manner if you then go on to do so yourself.
Quote:
You must have had a rough time with it as the overall tone of your post is really quite negative there Nateypoo.
I didn't see anything negative about his initial reply,he simply stated his experience of the matter - and everyones experience is different. For example, if two people buy the ffxi starter pack and play for 30 days, one likes it and stays, one hates it and leaves - neither is wrong, they simply had different experiences and perceptions of the game.
If everyone shared the same opinion, there would never be any need for discussion forums at all :P
While his second reply did come across as rude, its possible that he misinterpreted what you said. You hardly did anything to cool the situation by continueing to respond, and being just as insulting (with less swearing admittedly) as he was.
Really, its a case of pot-calling-kettle. You can't complain of someone behaving in a certain manner if you then go on to do so yourself.
#7
Jul 11 2008 at 2:44 PM
Argue the points, not the person. I appreciate what you have posted, but it would seem you selectively chose a post that had nothing to do with the complaint.
I had a simple request. I am not trying to be a pain in the a$$.I have a fairly straightforward problem that I wanted dealt with/answered. And while I appreciate the comments, I am just looking for an administrative ruling on it guys.
I view this as a complaint. According to the header of this forum, I posted it here. It takes a lotta guts to stand up to a bully and just as much to air this out in public. It would have certainly been easier in private behind people's backs, but I didn't do it that way. As you can all see, I have all my cards on the table. Even though it adds additional scrutiny from any and all that come by.
Ya know, I am not one of the "super" regulars here. I don't have half a dozen sock accounts or even friends rating me up. I don't post +1 threads. I post answers to questions that other members have in areas where I have expertise based on my years in this game and I post legitimate questions hoping to get good answers that I can use in my game. Take a look at me on ffxiah. You don't see strange buying and selling habits. You can see my gear and levels right there, nothing special that any hard working player wouldn't have. Ask about me from people you know on the server. I am nothing special, just a regular but long term ffxi fan and a good player.
If this is acceptable behavior and language in an acceptable location and typical of what Alla supports in that forum, I would just like to see an admin confirm or deny. I will adjust I will deal with it accordingly. Ima just trying to play by the rules.
I am standing up, risking my account and credibility to get answers on tough questions.
Any admins out there?
Late add: It appears that Nateypoo has edited and quickly taken out portions of his derogatory statements. My full, complete and unedited posts remain.
I had a simple request. I am not trying to be a pain in the a$$.I have a fairly straightforward problem that I wanted dealt with/answered. And while I appreciate the comments, I am just looking for an administrative ruling on it guys.
I view this as a complaint. According to the header of this forum, I posted it here. It takes a lotta guts to stand up to a bully and just as much to air this out in public. It would have certainly been easier in private behind people's backs, but I didn't do it that way. As you can all see, I have all my cards on the table. Even though it adds additional scrutiny from any and all that come by.
Ya know, I am not one of the "super" regulars here. I don't have half a dozen sock accounts or even friends rating me up. I don't post +1 threads. I post answers to questions that other members have in areas where I have expertise based on my years in this game and I post legitimate questions hoping to get good answers that I can use in my game. Take a look at me on ffxiah. You don't see strange buying and selling habits. You can see my gear and levels right there, nothing special that any hard working player wouldn't have. Ask about me from people you know on the server. I am nothing special, just a regular but long term ffxi fan and a good player.
If this is acceptable behavior and language in an acceptable location and typical of what Alla supports in that forum, I would just like to see an admin confirm or deny. I will adjust I will deal with it accordingly. Ima just trying to play by the rules.
I am standing up, risking my account and credibility to get answers on tough questions.
Any admins out there?
Late add: It appears that Nateypoo has edited and quickly taken out portions of his derogatory statements. My full, complete and unedited posts remain.
#8
Jul 11 2008 at 4:58 PM
Oh go waste someone else's time. Quit whining, he was polite, you were rude. He gave as good as you put out there, if you can't take it, too bad. This will be the admin's answer if they even waste the precious seconds it takes to tell you to shut up and move on. Actually it will probably be "Karma working as intended".
#9
Jul 11 2008 at 5:27 PM
Not too sure why you seem to have such a vested interest in this post Katie.
I don't whine.
Just trying to get an answer.
I don't whine.
Just trying to get an answer.
#10
Jul 11 2008 at 6:44 PM
Knock it off Katie, you aren't helping, nor are you an admin. I will take a look at it.
#11
Jul 11 2008 at 6:46 PM
I do not agree with Katie's harsh remarks, but her sentiment is the same no matter how she comes across. I see Nat as constructive criticism and you went off on him.
#12
Jul 11 2008 at 7:14 PM
Ok here's the deal.
I've read through the thread, DF and I have talked and it is currently locked until we are finished. What I see here is two people who bumped heads, got pissy with each other and started flaming back n forth in a thread that was started under the best of circumstances. I seriously doubt either of you intended to get into a flame fest but that's where it ended up.
That said, while your remarks were overall more polite than Nate's, one in particular came across as incredibly condescending to me. The comment in question:.
Now, you may not have meant it that way but that's how it came across to me and seemingly to the other poster, who reacted in kind, albeit more rudely. This doesn't mean he was justified in jumping you anymore than you were justified in blasting back and keeping it going. But as I see it, the quote in question appears to be what prompted this. Then you both fed it and kept it going.
So, both of you should probably just chill out and agree to disagree, since this is a forum and there will be a lot of different opinions, or we can help you with that if this starts back up. I would prefer you both choose the former, its really less hassle for you both and I'd rather see two regulars enjoying the forums anyways.
If you feel like it, you are always welcome to PM me regarding this as well.
I've read through the thread, DF and I have talked and it is currently locked until we are finished. What I see here is two people who bumped heads, got pissy with each other and started flaming back n forth in a thread that was started under the best of circumstances. I seriously doubt either of you intended to get into a flame fest but that's where it ended up.
That said, while your remarks were overall more polite than Nate's, one in particular came across as incredibly condescending to me. The comment in question:
Quote:
...You must have had a rough time with it as the overall tone of your post is really quite negative there Nateypoo. For whatever reason you had a tough time skilling up on the orcs, while I offer you /comfort...I must say that I did not. I averaged a full level an hour during my time there and was quite frankly, pretty well pleased with that area. I had 3-4 mnk orcs beating on me as I targeted a nearby RNG orc....
Now, you may not have meant it that way but that's how it came across to me and seemingly to the other poster, who reacted in kind, albeit more rudely. This doesn't mean he was justified in jumping you anymore than you were justified in blasting back and keeping it going. But as I see it, the quote in question appears to be what prompted this. Then you both fed it and kept it going.
So, both of you should probably just chill out and agree to disagree, since this is a forum and there will be a lot of different opinions, or we can help you with that if this starts back up. I would prefer you both choose the former, its really less hassle for you both and I'd rather see two regulars enjoying the forums anyways.
If you feel like it, you are always welcome to PM me regarding this as well.
#13
Jul 11 2008 at 10:48 PM
All I have to say is.. Welcome to the Internet.
Dear people I don't like: 凸(â—´―｀â—)凸
#14
Jul 12 2008 at 3:31 AM
Deadgye wrote:
All I have to say is.. Welcome to the Internet.
We got fun and games#
#15
Jul 12 2008 at 5:42 AM
People are arguing?! On MY internet?!
#16
Jul 12 2008 at 6:21 AM
Wordaen, Keeper of the Banstick wrote:
Knock it off Katie, you aren't helping, nor are you an admin. I will take a look at it.
Edited, Jul 12th 2008 9:20am by Jophiel
Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
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