Hey Enthuz, I'm Singaporean too ^^
Currently I think the issue of discrimination is not as serious as it seems, since most of the Chinese/Singaporean players I know can get along just fine with the JP and NA players. I didn't know that Greenlvdao/Redlvdao was not a gil seller until you clarified things, I naturally assumed he was given his method of advertising his teleports. >.<
My guess is if you speak English fine, most NA players would assume that you're American (My LS didn't know I was Singaporean until a year later, they thought I was first American, then Japanese, before realizing I'm neither >.>) I'm thinking that the only reason people would misjudge Chinese players to be gilsellers is because a minority of us can't speak much English, and this is line with the gilsellers who mostly speak little English, thus causing the misunderstanding.
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MerovingianofCerberus wrote:
Hey Enthuz, I'm Singaporean too ^^
Currently I think the issue of discrimination is not as serious as it seems, since most of the Chinese/Singaporean players I know can get along just fine with the JP and NA players. I didn't know that Greenlvdao/Redlvdao was not a gil seller until you clarified things, I naturally assumed he was given his method of advertising his teleports. >.<
My guess is if you speak English fine, most NA players would assume that you're American (My LS didn't know I was Singaporean until a year later, they thought I was first American, then Japanese, before realizing I'm neither >.>) I'm thinking that the only reason people would misjudge Chinese players to be gilsellers is because a minority of us can't speak much English, and this is line with the gilsellers who mostly speak little English, thus causing the misunderstanding.
Currently I think the issue of discrimination is not as serious as it seems, since most of the Chinese/Singaporean players I know can get along just fine with the JP and NA players. I didn't know that Greenlvdao/Redlvdao was not a gil seller until you clarified things, I naturally assumed he was given his method of advertising his teleports. >.<
My guess is if you speak English fine, most NA players would assume that you're American (My LS didn't know I was Singaporean until a year later, they thought I was first American, then Japanese, before realizing I'm neither >.>) I'm thinking that the only reason people would misjudge Chinese players to be gilsellers is because a minority of us can't speak much English, and this is line with the gilsellers who mostly speak little English, thus causing the misunderstanding.
lol, it'll be great to party up some time. :) ^5
yea, my ls didn't know anything about my nationality till it was discussed recently. they just found it strange at first that i spoke english, 'chinese' and japanese (a little). funny how people assume you're the same the moment you speak their language.
yea, redlvdao/greenlvdao has been rather misunderstood. :) he knows a little english, but not enough to converse at this level. it's kinda hard for him to get any parties therefore, save with chinese friends. i've partied with him once though, but i must add that he probably is a better pld (redlvdao) than he is a whm (greenlvdao). atm, anyway. after our resident smn taught him a few tricks, maybe he got better as a whm too. LOL
Quote:
you dont win the race of life for being white or black, although you might win it for being purple.
lol.
Scholar
17 posts
Leetfade, I'm from the Cincinnati area and what you said about UC is why I didn't bother going there after signing up. I currently reside in the suburb/rural areas to the north of the city, the next county up. And from living around here you tend to see more discrimintation between race, religion and even where you live than you can stomach sometimes.
/begin synthing some popcorn...
(take 1xfire crystal, add 1xmillionear corn, 1xselbima butter, 1xchunk of rock salt, 1xgoblin bowl, j/k..;p)
I grew up in a mostly "white" community and really never had contact with "black" people or people of other nationalities until high school. My parents tried to teach me and my (faternal)twin sister not to be racist or prejudice to people, "..everyone is just as same as you. Their skin maybe different and they may be from a different country, upbringing or have different religious beliefs, but you should try to get to know them and get along with them, they aren't that dissimilar(sp?) than you." That's basically what I was taught. On a few occasions I can remember my mom, threatening my grandparents(her parents) that they would never see their grandchildren again if they used that type of language in front of us, i.e. "niger, chinq, spik, diego" as some of the phrases I can remember. We were warned never to ever use these words as for they were the worse form of hate, possible. As you can imagine as a 9yr old, you wonder why your wonderful and loving grandpa just called a baseball player that on the T.V.
I occasionally had "colored" friends of various nationallities and never got any negative vives from my parents growing up around people like that. None from any of my relatives on my mothers side or fathers side of the family ever seemed to be racist except our grandparents on both sides. I was told people were just ignorant and were brought up differently when they grew up as well as when my parents grew up. However, I got a rude awakening in high school when you occasionally heard people whispering about someone or their family or where they were from. I mean I wasn't so naieve that I didn't know there were prejudice people around; I just wasn't awhere that so many people discriminated about minor things, especially of where you live at and where you grew up at. So and so is from that neighborhood blah blah blah, especially against the white people that lived in predominantly black neighborhoods or people from other religious neighborhoods for some reason(where I lived and went to school was mainly catholic, prodestant and presbitarian and for me to tell you the difference I have know idea, I'm not really religious or ever gone to church). I mean Enthuz not all Americans are like this maybe 10-15% atmost but it is a little unsettling, when the majority of the people around you are that way.
Now as for the Cincinnati, that itself is a whole nother story. I've never actually lived in the city limits or went to school there either, but I've always lived in the "suburban area" around the city. Cincinnati is a rather conservative city, set in the old way of things, I think founded like less than 10yrs after the USA was founded, maybe 1783?, so you have areas divided into various religious areas, jewish neighborhoods, catholic neighborhoods; racial/income areas mainly.
(Finally have some time to finish post, some notes made towards some of the threads farther down.)
Cincinnati seems to have be rooted in discrimination, like Leet said in another post, it's sad to see your own city on the national news due to riots. Sometimes it seems, atleast here that people try to look for a reason to discriminate or to riot over anything they can and you hope that the ones that have 2+ children don't pass this on to them. I have made a few friends that live in 'Over the Rine'(sp?), it's a very poor neighborhood that's mainly black or atleast the part I've been through and has a lot of drugs and murders/homicides. I've dropped my friends off and have had police pull me over and ask me what I'm doing there and have also had myself and my car searched for drugs w/out a canine-unit on several occasions just because I had different county tags on and also the local gang their wanted to beat me up because of that as well. I tell you what, nothing ruins your day like picking your friend up from his apartment there and both of you getting mugged by about a half dozen guys with pistols calling you a "Clan-mutha-f#%#%^&" just while walking to your car because you have a different county tags. And then one of them realizing the guy with you is one of the gang's leaders little brother and then getting your money back and being apologized to. And then getting in your car and driving about a hundred feet and only to have the cops pull you over and have to sit in the back of one of the cop cars handcuffed with your buddy while the canine-unit checks your car all the time wondering,
Where the F^^^ were these two cop cars 10mins ago when the 2 of you were getting mugged!?!?
The year I attempted to go to UC wasn't that great. I cancelled my classes after a few weeks because of the way I was treated by other students. UC brings in a lot of people, not just nationwide but a lot of foreigners of just about every country in the world it seems. Especially people from southeast-asia, atleast the semester I was there, there seemed to be quite a few. I had a friend there, that was there from Japan and I had originally met while playing an MMORPG. While my girl/friend(god she was hot /drool)at the time was born and raised here in the U.S. but her father grew up in Taiwan(sp?) and her mother grew up in South Korea, so I had two friends that were fluent in foreign languages. To say the least there were 'racial cliques' there and some of them were rather rude and said some nasty things from what my JP friend and my girl told me. I always treated them with the utmost respect, I mean I know they are here visiting the U.S. to go to college, trying to live in a place that is halfway around the world from where they call home. And I'm sure they have enough stress trying to get an education in a language they aren't that fluant in, so why give them any more troubles and what the heck you might make some more friends. I ended up making a few friends and a girlfriend for whom I dated after my other girlfriend dumped me for quitting school. But no matter how hard you try to be nice there are always going to be some @$$holes no matter if they are American, Canadian, Japanese, Chinese or even Mexican. And my semester there seemed to be a few there for every country in the world as well. So I ended up canceling all my classes after just a few weeks. And I thought to myself, I hope none of these people wonder too far in the wrong directions from the UC campus and start an international incident, because there are few rather rough neighborhoods no farther than a 5mile radius from there. Or end up going back to their country and only to one day become someone of power in their own country.
I try never to descriminate against other people and especially in FFXI. Some of the best groups I've been in have had Japanese and Chinese people in them. Give you a great one for example, my first group in the dunes at lv 11: Me a US whm, 3 JP mnk/war, 1 Chinese mnk/thf and his brother a rdm/whm, we all got to lv16 in probably 2hours. Also these guys all had on primarily white and blue-ringed equip and weapons so I'm sure that made a big difference as well. It gave me a very poor illusion of what the dunes were really like and what was in store for, though. But come to think of it that was probably the best exp party I had ever been in. The next 2 or 3 dozen or so parties were all U.S. member parties and I ended up being de-lv'd in the process all the way back into lv13, talk about getting kicked in the groin(yes I'm a dude, Karijess was originally a random name/creation for a mule for my friend). Some people stated in other parts of these threads what people think and I usually don't group with people that make assumption just because of someones nationality. This will usually get them put on either my 20k+ gil raise or 1mil+ gil raise or on my never raise lists depending on how harsh the comments are.
In closing I have dropped out of some really good parties because of the use of racial and/or nationality remarks even after asking them not to and they freak out when you do and have unfrotunately made a quite a few enemies because of this. I've also destroyed a few linkshells because of this as well. It's really sad that there is some many people that ruin a great game like Final Fantasy XI. A lot of times I will just do duo and trio parties just because for some reason I always seem to end up with all the @$$holes in this game. So if you all keep it honest and refrain from excessive amount of discrimination remarks I'd gladly join your group, if I could ever find the time to get on.
just my 2gil.... and then some...
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
p.s. Sorry it took so long to finish this post, been having to work a few 10 hour days and with a bi-otch of a co-worker and it hasn't to much fun lately. I will attempt to finish posts before posting them from now on...
Edited, Thu Dec 9 12:08:39 2004 by bakardiionefiftyone
/begin synthing some popcorn...
(take 1xfire crystal, add 1xmillionear corn, 1xselbima butter, 1xchunk of rock salt, 1xgoblin bowl, j/k..;p)
I grew up in a mostly "white" community and really never had contact with "black" people or people of other nationalities until high school. My parents tried to teach me and my (faternal)twin sister not to be racist or prejudice to people, "..everyone is just as same as you. Their skin maybe different and they may be from a different country, upbringing or have different religious beliefs, but you should try to get to know them and get along with them, they aren't that dissimilar(sp?) than you." That's basically what I was taught. On a few occasions I can remember my mom, threatening my grandparents(her parents) that they would never see their grandchildren again if they used that type of language in front of us, i.e. "niger, chinq, spik, diego" as some of the phrases I can remember. We were warned never to ever use these words as for they were the worse form of hate, possible. As you can imagine as a 9yr old, you wonder why your wonderful and loving grandpa just called a baseball player that on the T.V.
I occasionally had "colored" friends of various nationallities and never got any negative vives from my parents growing up around people like that. None from any of my relatives on my mothers side or fathers side of the family ever seemed to be racist except our grandparents on both sides. I was told people were just ignorant and were brought up differently when they grew up as well as when my parents grew up. However, I got a rude awakening in high school when you occasionally heard people whispering about someone or their family or where they were from. I mean I wasn't so naieve that I didn't know there were prejudice people around; I just wasn't awhere that so many people discriminated about minor things, especially of where you live at and where you grew up at. So and so is from that neighborhood blah blah blah, especially against the white people that lived in predominantly black neighborhoods or people from other religious neighborhoods for some reason(where I lived and went to school was mainly catholic, prodestant and presbitarian and for me to tell you the difference I have know idea, I'm not really religious or ever gone to church). I mean Enthuz not all Americans are like this maybe 10-15% atmost but it is a little unsettling, when the majority of the people around you are that way.
Now as for the Cincinnati, that itself is a whole nother story. I've never actually lived in the city limits or went to school there either, but I've always lived in the "suburban area" around the city. Cincinnati is a rather conservative city, set in the old way of things, I think founded like less than 10yrs after the USA was founded, maybe 1783?, so you have areas divided into various religious areas, jewish neighborhoods, catholic neighborhoods; racial/income areas mainly.
(Finally have some time to finish post, some notes made towards some of the threads farther down.)
Cincinnati seems to have be rooted in discrimination, like Leet said in another post, it's sad to see your own city on the national news due to riots. Sometimes it seems, atleast here that people try to look for a reason to discriminate or to riot over anything they can and you hope that the ones that have 2+ children don't pass this on to them. I have made a few friends that live in 'Over the Rine'(sp?), it's a very poor neighborhood that's mainly black or atleast the part I've been through and has a lot of drugs and murders/homicides. I've dropped my friends off and have had police pull me over and ask me what I'm doing there and have also had myself and my car searched for drugs w/out a canine-unit on several occasions just because I had different county tags on and also the local gang their wanted to beat me up because of that as well. I tell you what, nothing ruins your day like picking your friend up from his apartment there and both of you getting mugged by about a half dozen guys with pistols calling you a "Clan-mutha-f#%#%^&" just while walking to your car because you have a different county tags. And then one of them realizing the guy with you is one of the gang's leaders little brother and then getting your money back and being apologized to. And then getting in your car and driving about a hundred feet and only to have the cops pull you over and have to sit in the back of one of the cop cars handcuffed with your buddy while the canine-unit checks your car all the time wondering,
Where the F^^^ were these two cop cars 10mins ago when the 2 of you were getting mugged!?!?
The year I attempted to go to UC wasn't that great. I cancelled my classes after a few weeks because of the way I was treated by other students. UC brings in a lot of people, not just nationwide but a lot of foreigners of just about every country in the world it seems. Especially people from southeast-asia, atleast the semester I was there, there seemed to be quite a few. I had a friend there, that was there from Japan and I had originally met while playing an MMORPG. While my girl/friend(god she was hot /drool)at the time was born and raised here in the U.S. but her father grew up in Taiwan(sp?) and her mother grew up in South Korea, so I had two friends that were fluent in foreign languages. To say the least there were 'racial cliques' there and some of them were rather rude and said some nasty things from what my JP friend and my girl told me. I always treated them with the utmost respect, I mean I know they are here visiting the U.S. to go to college, trying to live in a place that is halfway around the world from where they call home. And I'm sure they have enough stress trying to get an education in a language they aren't that fluant in, so why give them any more troubles and what the heck you might make some more friends. I ended up making a few friends and a girlfriend for whom I dated after my other girlfriend dumped me for quitting school. But no matter how hard you try to be nice there are always going to be some @$$holes no matter if they are American, Canadian, Japanese, Chinese or even Mexican. And my semester there seemed to be a few there for every country in the world as well. So I ended up canceling all my classes after just a few weeks. And I thought to myself, I hope none of these people wonder too far in the wrong directions from the UC campus and start an international incident, because there are few rather rough neighborhoods no farther than a 5mile radius from there. Or end up going back to their country and only to one day become someone of power in their own country.
I try never to descriminate against other people and especially in FFXI. Some of the best groups I've been in have had Japanese and Chinese people in them. Give you a great one for example, my first group in the dunes at lv 11: Me a US whm, 3 JP mnk/war, 1 Chinese mnk/thf and his brother a rdm/whm, we all got to lv16 in probably 2hours. Also these guys all had on primarily white and blue-ringed equip and weapons so I'm sure that made a big difference as well. It gave me a very poor illusion of what the dunes were really like and what was in store for, though. But come to think of it that was probably the best exp party I had ever been in. The next 2 or 3 dozen or so parties were all U.S. member parties and I ended up being de-lv'd in the process all the way back into lv13, talk about getting kicked in the groin(yes I'm a dude, Karijess was originally a random name/creation for a mule for my friend). Some people stated in other parts of these threads what people think and I usually don't group with people that make assumption just because of someones nationality. This will usually get them put on either my 20k+ gil raise or 1mil+ gil raise or on my never raise lists depending on how harsh the comments are.
In closing I have dropped out of some really good parties because of the use of racial and/or nationality remarks even after asking them not to and they freak out when you do and have unfrotunately made a quite a few enemies because of this. I've also destroyed a few linkshells because of this as well. It's really sad that there is some many people that ruin a great game like Final Fantasy XI. A lot of times I will just do duo and trio parties just because for some reason I always seem to end up with all the @$$holes in this game. So if you all keep it honest and refrain from excessive amount of discrimination remarks I'd gladly join your group, if I could ever find the time to get on.
just my 2gil.... and then some...
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
p.s. Sorry it took so long to finish this post, been having to work a few 10 hour days and with a bi-otch of a co-worker and it hasn't to much fun lately. I will attempt to finish posts before posting them from now on...
Edited, Thu Dec 9 12:08:39 2004 by bakardiionefiftyone
Leet and Karijess... You're in Cinci?
I just moved to Dayton a year ago... First time I've been this close to the KKK. It's a VERY scary thing for me to think about.
Just the thought of an organized hate group drives me insane.
I will admit it's a good ole boy town.
I just moved to Dayton a year ago... First time I've been this close to the KKK. It's a VERY scary thing for me to think about.
Just the thought of an organized hate group drives me insane.
I will admit it's a good ole boy town.
I noticed in the posts by everyone else that it was mainly towards the chinese, and who's a gilseller and who's not.(forgive me if it was already mentioned but....) I personally hate the fact that most jp dont even want too party with NA's period. I think its extremely racial, why? Becuase I have a JP freind who told me that most JP highschools teach some English. So i would think it would be enough too play a MMO with ppl from NA. I have pt'd with jp players though and its been just like a regular pt. Just since i'm workin days now and I get on during JP primetime and its nearly impossible too get a party.
20 ppl lookin for pt and every one of theyre comments say: "JP ONLY!" or {English}{No Thanks!} bah :(
20 ppl lookin for pt and every one of theyre comments say: "JP ONLY!" or {English}{No Thanks!} bah :(
Scholar
20 posts
Enth-
You rock so hard! Damn, boyo!
This was a conversation that really needed to happen...thank you for starting it.
--Shabet
You rock so hard! Damn, boyo!
This was a conversation that really needed to happen...thank you for starting it.
--Shabet
Yes I agree with your chinese statement... I'm the only american in my LS, and the rest are all chinese, and I don't like the hate they've all recieved...
ShadowkillerX wrote:
I noticed in the posts by everyone else that it was mainly towards the chinese, and who's a gilseller and who's not.(forgive me if it was already mentioned but....) I personally hate the fact that most jp dont even want too party with NA's period. I think its extremely racial, why? Becuase I have a JP freind who told me that most JP highschools teach some English. So i would think it would be enough too play a MMO with ppl from NA. I have pt'd with jp players though and its been just like a regular pt. Just since i'm workin days now and I get on during JP primetime and its nearly impossible too get a party.
20 ppl lookin for pt and every one of theyre comments say: "JP ONLY!" or {English}{No Thanks!} bah :(
20 ppl lookin for pt and every one of theyre comments say: "JP ONLY!" or {English}{No Thanks!} bah :(
i've been to japan at 2 times during my high school for a 1 week long exchange program each, as well as 1 time with my family for a holiday. while this isn't enough to claim expertise in JP/NA relationships, i must add that there are a couple of observations that i've made:
all JP have to take english as a language. if they work in companies, you would even find the adults having to attend compulsory english classes so that they can actually read/write/converse in english. the only reason that they use it however is to comunicate in the business world.
when you step into japan though, you immediately realize that their entire culture revolves around their language and traditions. no one, and i really mean no one, speaks english on the streets. english makes all of them uncomfortable at best. and only when situation demands it (i.e. a business function, like the one i attended with my dad), will they actually speak english.
i can bet you that 2 years of japanese in high school or college isn't even enough to scratch the surface of conversation with JP people. likewise, a few years of english language education (with no real application outside of the business world) for the japanese isn't about to miraculously make them all comfortable conversing with it.
there ARE other factors of course, and i'm not saying JP are not guilty of discrimination themselves. but before people start flaming them for their actions, it may be a good time to sit back and reflect on oneself first.
Ok thats all cool and interesting, but anyway my point is some of them wont play FFXI with me, >.> lol
Edited, Sun Dec 5 13:01:48 2004 by ShadowkillerX
Edited, Sun Dec 5 13:01:48 2004 by ShadowkillerX
heh, awww... i'll play with you shadowkiller :) i'll speak entirely in romanji too so you can have a pseudo-japanese experience. :)
j/king ^^
j/king ^^
hahah lmao. ok thanx =P lol
LoL, Mattea. I still can't believe you live 2 mins away from me. That's kinda freaky. :-b
I think we're getting too far on Cincy bashing. LoL. There are good qualities of Cincinnati too. But it's really disheartening to see your city on national news regarding inter-racial hate crimes ><. I really think it's gotten better in the past year or so though.
As far as the KKK, I'm white and I'd like to tie them to their burning crosses. ><. I actually stumbled upon a meeting in N. Carolina one time when out with a bunch of friends, one black. That was not a welcoming experience. ><. For those that saw South Park the movie, instead of Operation get behind the darkies, it was Operation hide the darkies and run like hell. That's one thing that will rile me up, intolerance of others because of differences.
/slap Mattea
You live in Centerville man. We are in snobsville, not hate crime central. That's 20 miles up the road. :-D
I think we're getting too far on Cincy bashing. LoL. There are good qualities of Cincinnati too. But it's really disheartening to see your city on national news regarding inter-racial hate crimes ><. I really think it's gotten better in the past year or so though.
As far as the KKK, I'm white and I'd like to tie them to their burning crosses. ><. I actually stumbled upon a meeting in N. Carolina one time when out with a bunch of friends, one black. That was not a welcoming experience. ><. For those that saw South Park the movie, instead of Operation get behind the darkies, it was Operation hide the darkies and run like hell. That's one thing that will rile me up, intolerance of others because of differences.
/slap Mattea
You live in Centerville man. We are in snobsville, not hate crime central. That's 20 miles up the road. :-D
Centerville = WASP city. I overheard someone at the Kroger comment on why there were "color" people in their shopping.
We have Chevy Chase right across the street and they "the deemed outsiders" are even too scared to go to Kroger.
I seriously had heard that there were KKK setups within miles of Centerville, as I also heard that folks had been found dead in the big freaky shriner castle across from where I work. (Folks, you have to see this place.. its HUGE it looks like a freakin castle)
Anyway, yeah I know TOTALLY off topic. but some what ties in.
You have to be careful what you are saying out there in game world. You never know who you are talking to. They could be 13 they could be 113. They could be any color of the rainbow. They could be any where in the world. They could be straight, gay, bi, transgendered, asexual (for you mithras and galkas). They could be any religion. You name it, they could be it. (They, being other gamers) You just don't know. You never know how close they live to you either. Come to find out Leet lives walking distance to my house.
The point is, although this is a game, have fun, and just because you're in cyber land don't forget that on the other side of that terminal is another huamn being with feelings and emotions. Be considerate to your fellow gamers.
We have Chevy Chase right across the street and they "the deemed outsiders" are even too scared to go to Kroger.
I seriously had heard that there were KKK setups within miles of Centerville, as I also heard that folks had been found dead in the big freaky shriner castle across from where I work. (Folks, you have to see this place.. its HUGE it looks like a freakin castle)
Anyway, yeah I know TOTALLY off topic. but some what ties in.
You have to be careful what you are saying out there in game world. You never know who you are talking to. They could be 13 they could be 113. They could be any color of the rainbow. They could be any where in the world. They could be straight, gay, bi, transgendered, asexual (for you mithras and galkas). They could be any religion. You name it, they could be it. (They, being other gamers) You just don't know. You never know how close they live to you either. Come to find out Leet lives walking distance to my house.
The point is, although this is a game, have fun, and just because you're in cyber land don't forget that on the other side of that terminal is another huamn being with feelings and emotions. Be considerate to your fellow gamers.
Quote:
The point is, although this is a game, have fun, and just because you're in cyber land don't forget that on the other side of that terminal is another huamn being with feelings and emotions. Be considerate to your fellow gamers.
Well said.
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