i found this topic intresting and somewhat funny geez couldnt they just keep this in the RDM forums or something? i know im not helping the situation, but i couldnt help myself and laugh at this. check out the link
http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=32&mid=1111272062991721588&num=52
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hmmm.. interesting... o.O;
about rdm... i had a pt in onzozo few days ago with a rdm.. that sucked X_x
i dun usually ask for refresh since if it wears they'll eventually get to me =P
but... i had to ask multiple times in that pt.. and i can say i had less than 10 refresh during that pt... >< when i ask for refresh.. you see the rdm refreshes himself... and he's at full mp... poor spira sitting there... looking at the rdm, helpless >< and oh yea, he never converted since he's mp is always up
is it really that hard to keep refresh up >< its just like keeping haste up no? i'm doing that fine.. i think, well at least i haven't had any /p haste please and btw, reading that post lol i've only seen 1 rdm i've ptied with that helped me with haste and actually continue hasting the melee, not just once or twice....
about rdm... i had a pt in onzozo few days ago with a rdm.. that sucked X_x
i dun usually ask for refresh since if it wears they'll eventually get to me =P
but... i had to ask multiple times in that pt.. and i can say i had less than 10 refresh during that pt... >< when i ask for refresh.. you see the rdm refreshes himself... and he's at full mp... poor spira sitting there... looking at the rdm, helpless >< and oh yea, he never converted since he's mp is always up
is it really that hard to keep refresh up >< its just like keeping haste up no? i'm doing that fine.. i think, well at least i haven't had any /p haste please and btw, reading that post lol i've only seen 1 rdm i've ptied with that helped me with haste and actually continue hasting the melee, not just once or twice....
Hi Spira!! Good to see you around :)
Couldn't help buy weigh in on this issue. Please note this is not directed at you, my fellow PLD ;)
There are two problems with the refresh cycle. One, there is a hellova timer on it--something not everyone realizes. Two, cycle means just that--cycle.
I start with myself and then go down the list. Reason for starting with myself, it is much easier for me to see when Refresh drops and cycle needs to be started again. Most often the one screaming for Refresh is the one next in line...lol.
I will sometimes skip a player that is not using MP at the time. If I skip you, that doesn't mean you are unloved. It just means that Refresh is 40 MP a pop. 40 X 5 players...ouch.
One more note I would like to make. Refresh is not Hi-Ether. It does not hand you a bucketload of mana. MP management is still the responsibility of the individual player. If you have the Refresh symbol over your head and you are out of MP, please don't blame the RDM.
Edited, Thu Mar 24 08:20:20 2005 by Nyruu
Couldn't help buy weigh in on this issue. Please note this is not directed at you, my fellow PLD ;)
There are two problems with the refresh cycle. One, there is a hellova timer on it--something not everyone realizes. Two, cycle means just that--cycle.
I start with myself and then go down the list. Reason for starting with myself, it is much easier for me to see when Refresh drops and cycle needs to be started again. Most often the one screaming for Refresh is the one next in line...lol.
I will sometimes skip a player that is not using MP at the time. If I skip you, that doesn't mean you are unloved. It just means that Refresh is 40 MP a pop. 40 X 5 players...ouch.
One more note I would like to make. Refresh is not Hi-Ether. It does not hand you a bucketload of mana. MP management is still the responsibility of the individual player. If you have the Refresh symbol over your head and you are out of MP, please don't blame the RDM.
Edited, Thu Mar 24 08:20:20 2005 by Nyruu
Nyru is right on the money... the key is the cycle, watching for ppl's Refresh to run out (all I do anymore in battle is read the log!), and managing your own and everyone else's MP... it's easy (once you have been doing it a while) but not as easy as it sounds. And at 40 MP a pop with a 10 second (give or take) wait between casts, it's sometimes not that fun either!!
When in PT, after looking over what jobs are in need of MP and will need Refreshed, this is how I "start" in pt...
1) Eat pie
2) Cast Refresh on self
3) Dia and Paralyze
4) Refresh next MP needy person on list
5) 1 Enfeeb or Nuke
6) Refresh next MP needy person on list
7) 1 Enfeeb or Nuke (and heal when needed or in emergencies...)
8) Refresh next MP needy person on list
and so on... can vary with PT set-up of course... (I hate an "MP deep" party!!! >.< )
Then after fight... keep this going as long as possible. I try not to convert too often, as I never know when I will need that JA in an emergency, but in my SP or a very good party I just "know" I won't need it and I Convert more often.
However, if your RDM is not refreshing you in-cycle or on the regular at least, let them know!! Then if they give you crap, mental note to never PT with them again... But if your Refresh just dropped, be patient... wait a short while to see what they are doing before asking for a Refresh. You may be next! You should see a pattern when you are working with a good RDM. Anyone that has played a high-lv RDM can fully understand and appreciate what the job entails... just as a person in your job can truly appreciate what you do!
It's the RDM's that really are bad that give the great RDM's a bad name!
** EDIT** I also Haste in that Refresh list... I usualy do the PLD as it's easy for me to remember to Haste them when I Refresh them... they wear at just about the same time.
=^.^=
Edited, Sat Mar 26 20:25:18 2005 by lewbaby
When in PT, after looking over what jobs are in need of MP and will need Refreshed, this is how I "start" in pt...
1) Eat pie
2) Cast Refresh on self
3) Dia and Paralyze
4) Refresh next MP needy person on list
5) 1 Enfeeb or Nuke
6) Refresh next MP needy person on list
7) 1 Enfeeb or Nuke (and heal when needed or in emergencies...)
8) Refresh next MP needy person on list
and so on... can vary with PT set-up of course... (I hate an "MP deep" party!!! >.< )
Then after fight... keep this going as long as possible. I try not to convert too often, as I never know when I will need that JA in an emergency, but in my SP or a very good party I just "know" I won't need it and I Convert more often.
However, if your RDM is not refreshing you in-cycle or on the regular at least, let them know!! Then if they give you crap, mental note to never PT with them again... But if your Refresh just dropped, be patient... wait a short while to see what they are doing before asking for a Refresh. You may be next! You should see a pattern when you are working with a good RDM. Anyone that has played a high-lv RDM can fully understand and appreciate what the job entails... just as a person in your job can truly appreciate what you do!
It's the RDM's that really are bad that give the great RDM's a bad name!
** EDIT** I also Haste in that Refresh list... I usualy do the PLD as it's easy for me to remember to Haste them when I Refresh them... they wear at just about the same time.
=^.^=
Edited, Sat Mar 26 20:25:18 2005 by lewbaby
lol, refresh cycle is fun.... but sometimes when the **** hit's the fan so to speak, i might miss something. usually resutling in refresh being down on everyone for about 20 seconds.. which sux... i hate it when that happens. as for haste, lately i've found that when i help with haste, the whm casts it anyways, and now i can't tell when the other persons haste drops x.x and when i see that, i stop wasting my mp on a spell that will likely be cast over. i do what i can, and try to have fun with it. ^_^
I haven't found myself casting Haste much at all in pty. I do have it macroed and ready to go, but I don't because of the reason Mornlithe stated. The only way you can manage a cycle effectively is to have command of it, and me throwing in a Haste would just mess up the WHM.
Since that is only my theory, I wouldn't mind some imput on the subject.
Since that is only my theory, I wouldn't mind some imput on the subject.
What's worked for me latley, Nyru, is talking to the WHM before pt starts. Generally, I volunteer to keep Haste on the puller and leave all other Haste to the WHM. That way there is no wasted mp if I miss a casting by the WHM or vice versa and if a Haste wears unnoticed both of us just need to look at the name requesting the Haste. If it's puller, I know to cast haste, anything else the WHM knows its their job. But you need to find what works best for you and the pt you're in.
I had a super cool Japanese RDM one night last week who made it a point to list who was next in the refresh cycle after each cast. It kept everyone happy, because no one is left in the dark about when they were due.
All it took was a macro something like
/p {Refresh} <lastst> {Just used it!} <stpc> {Up}^^
used right after he cast it on whoever.
It was pretty cool, and I made it a point to {Thank you.} after s/he refreshed me ^_^
-Jarden
All it took was a macro something like
/p {Refresh} <lastst> {Just used it!} <stpc> {Up}^^
used right after he cast it on whoever.
It was pretty cool, and I made it a point to {Thank you.} after s/he refreshed me ^_^
-Jarden
Well i understand the situation, although most of the times i'm the pt leader, i don't like to boss around or stuff, but if someone is bugging the rdm (or brd) or something then i'll ask them to have some more consideration or just to be polite in some cases.
Because there are some VERY annoying PLDs that just keep asking for Refresh when they have it on, but they don't have any mo because of over-casting~
But that doesn't apply only for RDMs but for WHMs too, the RDMs are already too busy refreshing and dispeling like to be casting "Haste" on the DRK, while the whm is standing there spamming Cures to the pally, so a couple of fights later the DRK starts getting pissed because after casting 2 spells he has fell beyond the RNG on TP too much, so he would like to have that "Haste" that has been had only by the pally with his underleveled Staff and missing 3x more than me, so his haste is kinda goin to waste while my 100+ hits are taking longer to land...
... so the DRK starts asking for Haste to the WHM, but he doesn't Haste him, next fight he asks for it again, and nothing, next fight he sends /tells to the whm asking him *directly* for Haste, so finally the DRK gets Haste.
3 fights later he hasn't been Hasted... so DRK gives up and just keeps praying for those Double Attacks and Criticals to kick more frequently...
Sorry about the rant... >.<
Because there are some VERY annoying PLDs that just keep asking for Refresh when they have it on, but they don't have any mo because of over-casting~
But that doesn't apply only for RDMs but for WHMs too, the RDMs are already too busy refreshing and dispeling like to be casting "Haste" on the DRK, while the whm is standing there spamming Cures to the pally, so a couple of fights later the DRK starts getting pissed because after casting 2 spells he has fell beyond the RNG on TP too much, so he would like to have that "Haste" that has been had only by the pally with his underleveled Staff and missing 3x more than me, so his haste is kinda goin to waste while my 100+ hits are taking longer to land...
... so the DRK starts asking for Haste to the WHM, but he doesn't Haste him, next fight he asks for it again, and nothing, next fight he sends /tells to the whm asking him *directly* for Haste, so finally the DRK gets Haste.
3 fights later he hasn't been Hasted... so DRK gives up and just keeps praying for those Double Attacks and Criticals to kick more frequently...
Sorry about the rant... >.<
hehe, not being biased or anything -wink- but if rdm says he/she will haste the specific person then i will not haste him/her, so it'll be up to the rdm to haste that the certain melee. since if i do , more than likely rdm will also haste him/her and overwrite it, so why waste 40 mp? =P
it does help when the rdm helps haste. since sometimes you have up to 4 people to haste, and it gets hard to keep it up (doingable, but thatz 160 mp used on haste). but i guess rdm has refresh to worry about, so its all communication on whether rdm takes up the job or not ;)
it does help when the rdm helps haste. since sometimes you have up to 4 people to haste, and it gets hard to keep it up (doingable, but thatz 160 mp used on haste). but i guess rdm has refresh to worry about, so its all communication on whether rdm takes up the job or not ;)
Quote:
I also Haste in that Refresh list... I usualy do the PLD as it's easy for me to remember to Haste them when I Refresh them... they wear at just about the same time.
Good point.
Thank you all for the imput! Much appreciated :)
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