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Paedophile to be beheaded and crucifiedFollow

#52 Nov 04 2009 at 9:27 AM Rating: Excellent
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jtftaru wrote:
I made the very simple point that if someone's guilt has been established quickly and easily for a heinous crime then I have no problem with the death penalty being applied.

In response to that very simple observation, all you have done in return is bleat about failing systems and instances where guilt may not be established.

I have no real objections to capital punishment as a theory. I could be convinced that certain crimes are heinous enough that death is fitting. I also know I depart from some others here on this point but I'm willing to be friendly with them even if they're wrong.

However, before you go killin' folks, you need a system to determine who you're gonna be a-killin'. Despite what I might think of it in theory, to quote one of my favorite political philosophers and most important influence on my life ever:
Homer Simpson wrote:
In theory, communism works. In theory.


The system is where it breaks down. Capital punishment, if you allow for controls to avoid executing innocents, is an unwieldy expensive beast with very little (if any) upside and still a degree of fallibility that can result in unrepairable harm. If you streamline it by eliminating controls, I can't support it because it subverts what I consider a just system of law.

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In order for a thread on a message board to work properly, you need to read what someone is saying and reply to that specific thing.
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If you have something to say to me, it needs to be in response to that point. Then I can respond to you and we can have a conversation. As someone once said, 'See how it works?'

Threads are like children. You give birth to them, nurture them, point them in a direction... and how they mature is anyone's guess.
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Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#53 Nov 04 2009 at 9:29 AM Rating: Good
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jtftaru wrote:
RedPhoenixxx wrote:
Sir Kavekk wrote:
I cast aspersions on your intellect and ability to reason.


To be fair, I think the level of UK based poster was not representative of the UK as a whole. We needed someone to lower the balance a bit.


Someone who just makes things up and who isn't capable of even knowing how to have a conversation let alone how to make a point doesn't really get to make comments about other people's intelligence.

It always amazes me how the worst aspects of the Internet can twist things round in their head and try to make out they are somehow intelligent and it's other people who are somewhat lacking, when it's they who can't even do the simplest things.

If I post in someone's thread, I respond to what they are saying and a conversation takes place. A simple process that seems totally beyond you.

The kind of angry, message board dimwit who can't bear the fact people don't agree with whatever he's saying is common enough. Finding 2 on one thread who don't even know how to have a conversation is pretty rare though.



Someone who just makes things up and who isn't capable of even knowing how to have a conversation let alone how to make a point doesn't really get to make comments about other people's intelligence.

It always amazes me how the worst aspects of the Internet can twist things round in their head and try to make out they are somehow intelligent and it's other people who are somewhat lacking, when it's they who can't even do the simplest things.

If I post in someone's thread, I respond to what they are saying and a conversation takes place. A simple process that seems totally beyond you.

The kind of angry, message board dimwit who can't bear the fact people don't agree with whatever he's saying is common enough.
Someone who just makes things up and who isn't capable of even knowing how to have a conversation let alone how to make a point doesn't really get to make comments about other people's intelligence.

It always amazes me how the worst aspects of the Internet can twist things round in their head and try to make out they are somehow intelligent and it's other people who are somewhat lacking, when it's they who can't even do the simplest things.

If I post in someone's thread, I respond to what they are saying and a conversation takes place. A simple process that seems totally beyond you.

The kind of angry, message board dimwit who can't bear the fact people don't agree with whatever he's saying is common enough. Finding 2 on one thread who don't even know how to have a conversation is pretty rare though.
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#54 Nov 04 2009 at 9:33 AM Rating: Good
jtftaru wrote:
RedPhoenixxx wrote:
Sir Kavekk wrote:
I cast aspersions on your intellect and ability to reason.


To be fair, I think the level of UK based poster was not representative of the UK as a whole. We needed someone to lower the balance a bit.


Someone who just makes things up and who isn't capable of even knowing how to have a conversation let alone how to make a point doesn't really get to make comments about other people's intelligence.

It always amazes me how the worst aspects of the Internet can twist things round in their head and try to make out they are somehow intelligent and it's other people who are somewhat lacking, when it's they who can't even do the simplest things.

If I post in someone's thread, I respond to what they are saying and a conversation takes place. A simple process that seems totally beyond you.

The kind of angry, message board dimwit who can't bear the fact people don't agree with whatever he's saying is common enough. Finding 2 on one thread who don't even know how to have a conversation is pretty rare though.


If that's how you respond to this post, I can't imagine how upset you'll be at the one where I tell you to go fuck yourself. I can't wait until 2013 when you answer it.

Anway, what I really wanted to say was that someone who just makes things up and who isn't capable of even knowing how to have a conversation let alone how to make a point doesn't really get to make comments about other people's intelligence.

It always amazes me how the worst aspects of the Internet can twist things round in their head and try to make out they are somehow intelligent and it's other people who are somewhat lacking, when it's they who can't even do the simplest things.

If I post in someone's thread, I respond to what they are saying and a conversation takes place. A simple process that seems totally beyond you.

The kind of angry, message board dimwit who can't bear the fact people don't agree with whatever he's saying is common enough. Finding 2 on one thread who don't even know how to have a conversation is pretty rare though.
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#55 Nov 04 2009 at 9:38 AM Rating: Good
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Paskil wrote:


I'll take our current system over a theocracy that executes homosexuals.


I object to classifying this perp as a homosexual. Same-sex preference in pedophiles has less to do with sexual orientation and more to do having a preferred victim profile, like many rapists who might prefer tall brunettes or whatever.

However, I suspect the reason this sentence is so harsh is BECAUSE the victims were male. Were they female, even children, his sentence would be much less harsh, and quite possibly the surviving girls would have been punished as well.

Dumb-*** Saudis.
#56 Nov 04 2009 at 9:50 AM Rating: Excellent
Look, jtfartu - if that is your real name - you're a fuckwit. The sad thing is that you're too short-sighted to realise this. Let's look at the facts here, OK? You're arguing with Red, a guy so smart he left France despite seventeen years of indoctrination. Do you really think you can best him, when your life story is a litany of miserable failures? Your inability to have an intellectual debate would be disturbing, if it weren't obvious that your mind is no loss to the world. Now, I'm sure you might impress your chip-grease-slick peers with your pathetic attempt to obfuscate the disconnect between what you are advocating and reality, but I'm afraid that those of us devoid of crippling mental problems are unimpressed. If I were to commit to words every insult that describes you, the tag cloud would block out the sun, and you could be an idiot in the shade. If I were a more nationalistic man, I would shove you in the nearest cannon and fire you across the channel, though you're probably too dense to travel outside British waters anyway.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that you're a complete imbecile and you're fooling nobody. I suggest you put yourself out of our misery and kill yourself.

Edited, Nov 4th 2009 3:57pm by Kavekk
#57 Nov 04 2009 at 9:53 AM Rating: Decent
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Paskil wrote:
But that's exactly it. There's a ridiculous percentage of cases where evidence is anecdotal. If I put my word as an eyewitness against yours, who is right in that case? How do you know that a group isn't conspiring against an individual because of their criminal history or other past activities? Most evidence in capital cases is not concrete hence the reason behind the long appeals process. Even after someone has been through a dozen appeals, there may be still something out there that proves their innocence. It is very rare that someone can be proven guilty beyond all reasonable doubt without time.


It's like you can't understand English. I'm not interested in cases where 'evidence is anecdotal'. Nor am I interested in talking about the application of the death penalty as a whole. There are plenty of times when guilt is easily established. In this thread, I made a point about a specific instance. If you have something to say, reply to that, not change the subject to something else you want to talk about.

Paskil wrote:

Where exactly in the story does it show that he's guilty beyond reasonable doubt? The only thing I can read from the story is that he was caught trying to abduct a child; a heinous crime but not exactly crucifixion/beheading worthy.


I specifically didn't say that he was. They haven't given enough details of the court case. I said that IF it was the case, I would have no problem with the death penalty being applied. A very simple observation that half the people on this thread have replied to in one post while the other half have failed hopelessly to.

Paskil wrote:

Perhaps you watch too much television. Really, life is far from a criminal leaving a trail of photographs and pictures and DNA evidence lying in a breadcrumb trail for the authorities. A long appeals process is necessary because monsters like you don't mind killing a few innocents to behead and crucify a alleged baby rapist. For all you know, Saudi Arabia is so caught up in deterring crime, they simply decided to execute the first child kidnapper they caught as an example and name him the rapist.


What a sick, nasty little prick you are. Calling people 'monsters' for pointing out that if a baby rapist/murderer is guilty of his crimes then the death penalty could be applied. Your behaviour in twisting words, refusing to even read what you are replying to and seemingly replying to voices in your head instead of what is written marks you out as a very weird, unpleasant human being. And your defence of a baby rapist/murderer when you have no reason to think he's innocent is worthy of a 'monster' tag. I'm beginning to see why the Asylum has its reputation for retards.

Paskil wrote:

Must have taken you a while to read a thousand (or million) blogs on the daily life of the Saudi Arabian, Czech Republic, and Singapore citizen. I need to learn to speed read, have any recommendations?


Yeah, I recommend you seek medical help. When you're cured, instead of choosing to be bigoted and ignorant, either speak to people from a region to get your knowledge of what it's like or go and travel to a place yourself and learn first hand what it's like. When you're done, you'll actually know things instead of having to make them up.

Paskil wrote:
Yeah I suppose your method is better. Lets hurry up and string up the trees so we can get rid of them ASAP. Would hate to not get right down to saving a few precious dollars in the name of deterrence.


Why would you string up trees? What have they done?

I pointed out that one specific baby rapist/murderer, if found conclusively guilty, should be sentenced to death for his crimes and in response you rant hysterically about mass killings and stringing up everyone regardless of crime or circumstance.

You have the mentality of a PETA member, a religious zealot or, I suppose, a typical message board poster...
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#58 Nov 04 2009 at 9:55 AM Rating: Decent
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You know what it's easier to just keep adding to this.

jftaru wrote:
Wish they would do that to some of the street scum here.


I know right

And if we happen to satisfy the furious and primal lust for blood upon the entirely superfluous process of murdering someone through the arm of the state - the state, our protector, lover, and sadistic punnishor - granting us prime ************ material at least for a good few days before turning once more to the carnal pleasures of ejaculating over the dead bodies of soldiers, dying in wars, the outrageously erotic hatred of Communists, destroying our values, and fucking the collective skull of the survivors of diced and discombobulated Americans, Britons, hell, everyone in the world, well? So much the better.

#59 Nov 04 2009 at 9:57 AM Rating: Good
Ambrya wrote:
Paskil wrote:


I'll take our current system over a theocracy that executes homosexuals.


I object to classifying this perp as a homosexual.


Paskil can correct me if I'm wrong, but that's not what he was doing. He was speaking about the actions of Saudi Arabia towards homosexuals in general.
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#60 Nov 04 2009 at 10:01 AM Rating: Good
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RedPhoenixxx wrote:
Ambrya wrote:
Paskil wrote:


I'll take our current system over a theocracy that executes homosexuals.


I object to classifying this perp as a homosexual.


Paskil can correct me if I'm wrong, but that's not what he was doing. He was speaking about the actions of Saudi Arabia towards homosexuals in general.


If so, sorry Paskil. It didn't read that way at first glance, but then that might be because the first thought that occurred to me as I read the article was that the reason the sentence was so harsh was because the victims were boys, so the two probably just overlapped in my mind.

damn flu
#61 Nov 04 2009 at 10:02 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
There are plenty of times when guilt is easily established.


Cite.

Quote:
Nor am I interested in talking about the application of the death penalty as a whole.
Quote:
Wish they would do that to some of the street scum here.


Hahaha.

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if found conclusively guilty


See, herein lies the problem.

Quote:
I specifically didn't say that he was. They haven't given enough details of the court case. I said that IF it was the case, I would have no problem with the death penalty being applied.
Quote:
Wish they would do that to some of the street scum here.


Hahaha.
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#62 Nov 04 2009 at 10:02 AM Rating: Decent
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Pensive the Ludicrous wrote:
jtftaru wrote:
RedPhoenixxx wrote:
jtftaru wrote:
Wish they would do that to some of the street scum here.

Apart from giving them the opportunity to re-enact a famous scene from Life of Brian, what difference would it make?


They wouldn't do it again, it would act as a deterrent and it would save the taxpayer the expensive prison costs.


It will also solve world hunger, deliver science a grand unified theory, cure AIDS, and make unicorns real.

Fucking gullible idiot.


Seeing as you've already gone out of your way to label yourself 'Ludicrous', I won't bother.

RedPhoenixxx wrote:
jtftaru wrote:
I made the point that the death sentence is valid in certain cases


Right, so your whole argument is that the death penalty would be useful in certain hypothetical cases, independently of any existing legal system, without taking into consideration any existing research, legal problems, or practical difficulties. So, basically, the death penalty is great for imaginary cases that have no relevance to anything in the outside world, and exist only in the vaccum of your mind.

Brilliant. When you feel like discussing on a level which isn't that of a 6 year old, come back to us.


You know, you almost addressed my point there. True, it was almost all insults, word twisting and more making stuff up, but you did actually try and address the point I made.

So I'm going to rate you up for the attempt because, let's face it, this is probably about as good as you get.
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#63 Nov 04 2009 at 10:04 AM Rating: Good
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This poster does not fail to deliver.

He's even invoking the *gasp* Karma!
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#64 Nov 04 2009 at 10:05 AM Rating: Decent
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Jophiel wrote:
Threads are like children. You give birth to them, nurture them, point them in a direction... and how they mature is anyone's guess.

So when can you **** them in the *** and abandon them out in the desert?

The only problem I have with the original article:

"Crucifixion in the conservative desert Kingdom means tying the convict’s body to wooden beams to be displayed to the public after he is decapitated by a professional swordsman. "

I propose they use novice swordsmen. Let them get a few practice swings in.
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#65 Nov 04 2009 at 10:07 AM Rating: Good
jtftaru wrote:
So I'm going to rate you up for the attempt because, let's face it, this is probably about as good as you get.


Don't bother.

Seriously, do us all a favour, and give up. It's pointless, really. We all think you're grade A moron who answers posts a decade late, what's the point in persevering? We all got your point ages ago, we all think it's retarded, and really the best course of action is for you to PM Varrus so you two can exchange email addresses and send each other videos of yourself ************ to snuff movies.

Also, you lied! You rated me down! Oh wait, I probably shouldn't expect you to know up from down, apologies.

Edited, Nov 4th 2009 4:17pm by RedPhoenixxx
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#66 Nov 04 2009 at 10:11 AM Rating: Good
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I would think the hygienic hazards presented with a crucifixion would have made the practice obsolete by now.

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#67 Nov 04 2009 at 10:11 AM Rating: Excellent
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Debalic wrote:
Jophiel wrote:
Threads are like children. You give birth to them, nurture them, point them in a direction... and how they mature is anyone's guess.

So when can you @#%^ them in the *** and abandon them out in the desert?

That's how most of our threads end.
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Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#68 Nov 04 2009 at 10:13 AM Rating: Decent
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Omegavegeta wrote:
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Yeah, I was thinking that. By the way, do you post on the Wiki forums also?


I don't think so? I post here & SomethingAwful.com very occasionally.

I also thing Battle Royale is the best alternative to the current American system presented on this page, as there is nothing reality TV combined with unchecked capitalism can't fix.

And the Battle Royale comic is WAY more @#%^ed up than the movie.


Ok, just someone with a similar name then.
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#69 Nov 04 2009 at 10:41 AM Rating: Good
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jftaru wrote:
Seeing as you've already gone out of your way to label yourself 'Ludicrous', I won't bother.


You might actually be the most self-deluded person I've met. Simply because I am such a wonderful person, I'll actually be the one to bite the fucking bullet and answer your stupidly childish question.

Let me play with you then, and address your actual "point." Let us assume for just a moment, you sniveling coward, that we can actually ascertain, with 100% certainty, that someone raped a child, and left it to die. Let us further let our minds wander about, you insipid poison, wallowing in the most deplorable and execrable locations we can imagine, from the frigid Niflheim to the realms of the Inferno, from the pits of the Abyss to the apathetic Gehenna, and let us infuse all of the evils of them, (perhaps the evils of yourself) into whatever criminal we'd like: the rape of a two year old and subsequent consuming its flesh; the skinning-alive of grandmothers; the bombing of day-cares as political terrorism. Let us then ask ourselves, you self-deludor, if any of these crimes are worthy of letting vengeance and bloodlust into our hearts sufficient to murder someone ourselves, in the name of just retribution, or even for the sake of just "containing" a person for life, but that nuking the criminal from orbit is the only way to be sure. Let us ask, given all of these things as true, if the state should be allowed to murder a person.

No, not even in the face of Armageddon.

Edited, Nov 4th 2009 11:49am by Pensive
#70 Nov 04 2009 at 10:53 AM Rating: Decent
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Uglysasquatch, Mercenary Major wrote:
Quote:
I made the very simple point that if someone's guilt has been established quickly and easily for a heinous crime then I have no problem with the death penalty being applied.
Here, I'll help you out.


If it were that simple, then yes, your point would mean something. Hell, I'd agree with you. However, no system created to date, has proven to be even remotely that simple, so everything Red and Locke are saying are valid points.


Their points aren't valid at all because they a.) don't relate to what I'm talking about and b.) because they simply aren't valid.

Here, I'll help you out.

I pointed out that criminals who commit certain crimes like raping or murdering babies deserve the death penalty.

Instead of responding to that, as several slightly more intelligent people did, a few of the posters in this thread started ranting about the failure of the US legal system and how it causes prisoners to stay on Death Row for years which, apparently, is more expensive than normal prison.

This for a start is wrong and simple maths tells you that.

A 25 year old prisoner on Death row for 20 years is still not going to cost as much as a prisoner sent to normal prison for 50 years.

Now, a system that is so crap, Death row inmates stay there for 20 years is nothing to do with the rightfulness of the death penalty. It's just a **** penal system.

Whatever the system, whatever the length of wait, there are certain occasions where the death penality is right and proper.

Raping then murdering babies qualifies. Although some of the sickos on this board think otherwise.

If you have issues with how the death penalty is carried out or the process by which a convicted prisoner gets from court to death chamber then go ahead and feel free to discuss it. That's nothing to do with me.

I just pointed out that on occasions the death penalty is right, a point that a few people here still can't manage to respond to without ranting about how it fails when applied in one specific crappy American system.

I believe the death penalty is a fitting punishment for scum who rape and murder babies. For chavs also.

If you want an indication of how to respond to that properly, take a look at Aripyanfar's post. He did it right first time.
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#71 Nov 04 2009 at 10:58 AM Rating: Excellent
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The expansive cost of the death penalty isn't due to rent on a prison cell, it's due to the legal costs to the state involved in all the appeals.
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Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#72 Nov 04 2009 at 11:01 AM Rating: Excellent
Quote:
Instead of responding to that, as several slightly more intelligent people did, a few of the posters in this thread started ranting about the failure of the US legal system and how it causes prisoners to stay on Death Row for years which, apparently, is more expensive than normal prison.

This for a start is wrong and simple maths tells you that.

A 25 year old prisoner on Death row for 20 years is still not going to cost as much as a prisoner sent to normal prison for 50 years.


No, you stupid fucker. Do you know how much it costs for all those appeals, all those sessions of court?

Quote:
If you want an indication of how to respond to that properly, take a look at Aripyanfar's post. He did it right first time.


Aripyanfar is not male.

Quote:
If you have issues with how the death penalty is carried out or the process by which a convicted prisoner gets from court to death chamber then go ahead and feel free to discuss it. That's nothing to do with me.

I just pointed out that on occasions the death penalty is right, a point that a few people here still can't manage to respond to without ranting about how it fails when applied in one specific crappy American system.


No one is referring specifically to one system, but to systems of justice in general and how you would go about implementing this in reality. You expressed a wish for the death penalty be instituted in Great Britain. No one is changing the topic - although it is not your divien right as topic starter to stop people doing so anyway.
#73 Nov 04 2009 at 11:06 AM Rating: Decent
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jftaru wrote:
Raping then murdering babies qualifies. Although some of the sickos on this board think otherwise.


haha irony

God you're a pathetic human.
#74 Nov 04 2009 at 11:08 AM Rating: Excellent
The guy who killed my mom pleaded guilty and was sentenced to 150 years in prison with parole in 80 years. If he lives to be 110 he's eligible for parole.

We were satisfied with that sentence. Rather than go through a years long legal battle to continue the cycle of blood, our family was okay with him living a long, miserable life rotting away behind bars.
#75 Nov 04 2009 at 11:18 AM Rating: Good
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Elinda wrote:
I would think the hygienic hazards presented with a crucifixion would have made the practice obsolete by now.



That's no way to feed the outrage **** market, Missy.

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#76 Nov 04 2009 at 11:39 AM Rating: Decent
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Jophiel wrote:
jtftaru wrote:
I made the very simple point that if someone's guilt has been established quickly and easily for a heinous crime then I have no problem with the death penalty being applied.

In response to that very simple observation, all you have done in return is bleat about failing systems and instances where guilt may not be established.

I have no real objections to capital punishment as a theory. I could be convinced that certain crimes are heinous enough that death is fitting. I also know I depart from some others here on this point but I'm willing to be friendly with them even if they're wrong.

However, before you go killin' folks, you need a system to determine who you're gonna be a-killin'. Despite what I might think of it in theory, to quote one of my favorite political philosophers and most important influence on my life ever:
Homer Simpson wrote:
In theory, communism works. In theory.


The system is where it breaks down. Capital punishment, if you allow for controls to avoid executing innocents, is an unwieldy expensive beast with very little (if any) upside and still a degree of fallibility that can result in unrepairable harm. If you streamline it by eliminating controls, I can't support it because it subverts what I consider a just system of law.


Fair enough.
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