A warning about an ls....Follow

Note: While I had hoped this post wouldve done some good and given the EternalKnights LS some sort of wake-up call to what kind of people they are and should stop treating people like **** and acting so perfect. The last discussion I had in the LS showed this to not be the case at all. Things were taken the wrong way, ignored or completely swept under the rug. With the constant reply of "if you cant handle it then leave" or "you dont have a ******* clue" Well you know whats funny? I DO have a clue, more so than any of you (you know who you are) I feel sorry for anyone who ends up in your ls, since they will likely be treated like inferior **** like most of us were. I even "hope beyond all hope" that some current members will finally realize how much yall are a bunch of thick-headed ******** and leave you with nothing but an empty ls, with pearls scattered all over Vana'diel. Yes I know most of you come here and proly jsut karma camp this thread but as long as atleast a few people see it I will be doing some good.

Yes this started with just being my goodbye post, but after you standing fast to your ******** attitude and sweeping things under the rug more I found that my goodbye would not have the proper affect. And so it comes to this. I warn everyone to avoid the EK ls, I know many people in thier "partner" ls's who are not any wiser. You may do what you wish but yall might want to spend a few days in the ls to see how it really is and you might be a bit shocked. And now w/o further delay...the actual post in its entirety



Ok let me start of by saying...well... strike 3 your out. though its more like strike 157 or something by now, let me explain... I came to this ls with the other SlumsOfBabylon people who most of which were originally in Babylon. Well we got invited into the Eternal Knights ls cause Slums was sorta falling apart as it wasnt turning out to be what many hoped it would. So the discussions were made and the agreements set and the move happened. The condition was all Slums member would get into EK and the requirements would be waived this one time until all members have moved over. Well the move happened and it was an exciting day, meeting lots of new people finding out the cool stuff we /would/ be doing. getting ZM stuff done, all the promyvion stuff, AF and then gods and dynamis. I was rather happy, I got an ls with strong players in it when I needed help in things like AF or limit quests. And an ls that would do promyvion that I would get invited to as a nin, which is something Ive really wanted to do but wouldnt an invite unless I was a 30 RNG or SMN, etc. And then of course it had all my friends from SoB in it so life was good. I went about my crafting and such as usual like I do, as most from SoB are aware lol! ;) Then one day something changed...

I sent my reply in for the "dream gear" thread and lo and behold Ryu found out I was a lvl 51 ninja at the time, she was so excited. and I quote


Ryunoire wrote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hey^^

I'm sooo glad you are in the LS, I didn't realize you are a NIN!

I need a NIN tank really badly... I will help you with anything you need, please let me know. Also we are doing an LS even of AFs this weekend, I think you should come, we can help you get some of your af pieces.

Please just make sure you have the quests active and we will see you on saturday. /tell me in game or PM me back if you need anything.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



So now Im even more excited that the ls really will help me with things I need to get into lvling again. I was also un-anon later that day and I got a very similar response from Dashutou. So again life was good and I had high hopes for this ls.

Now comes strike .7, a few days later there was a call for ZM4 (which I needed) by Ryu, so I said Im up for it as it was apparently an easy fight so I could come as a low lvl. So we get a party going and find we didnt have enough unlit lanterns. Ok so we talked about what were going to do and come up with a plan. Seeing as how it was going to take a little bit (we were going to wait for someone to login to see if they had anorther lanter) so I said Id go afk for some food and come back. The response was "ok" Well I was gone for 20-30 minutes. Came back to find myself alone and out of party still standing in Lower Jeuno. Well I figured the party broke up cause we couldnt get the lanterns and seeing as I got no /tells relating to it I let it go. Then did a /sea all linkshell to see what everyone was up to. Hey look at that, the party I was in was now in Yhaotor Jungle. Ok so they left w/o me, not too surprising given my lvl and all, didnt bother me much cause ZM was not a high priority. But I thought, well maybe they just went on ahead to get another lantern. So I asked in ls if I could still come for the ZM...no reply, asked again...no reply. I asked about 6 times in LS with no reply from anyone at all. I then sent a tell to Ryunoire TWO times asking the same question...no reply. Well that was special, all that talk about doing all these missions and hleping ls and stuff, AND the PM about how happy she was I was a ninja and that she'd be happy to help with quests and AF and all that... was now seeming to get a bit more vague in the whole "help" thing. Well that wasnt the first time I couldnt go on a mission and like I said, ZM wasnt major priority at the time so I let it go.

Now comes strike 1.6 And that was finding out several SoB members had been kicked from the LS, and for a rather bullsh*t reasons too. ok a BCNM ls? uhhh kinda like your Dynamis or Promyvion LS? gimme a break. But not only did I not see any mention of this by anyone such as "oh hey, a couple of your friends were kicked from this ls 2 days ago, did you hear?" Or nothing on the website either under that wonderful section of "linkshell issues". So that was disheartening and a bit infuriating.. And to find that another friend wasnt even invited to the LS was more irritating. And then hearing that others had already left the ls cause of stupid arguments, people being rude, absurd rules and various other things. So yay, now I dont get to talk to several friends while in the ls. Ok, still some friends left. moving on.

Strike 4.6, AF and LB2. starting last week (11-29-04) I asked in the ls a few times a day each day requesting help on the weekend for my lb2, because I was getting ready to start exping again and wanted to get it out of the way so I dont get discouraged (so I can become a great nin tank for gods etc etc blah blah). Well got a reply here and there saying they would. In the end we proly had enough to do it...IF they actually came and helped... So friday came..no help..saturday came and went...no help so saturday even I went to do my AF in Sea grotto since I had hit 54 on friday. I didnt bother asking for help, it didnt bother me. I could solo ok and dint die, but never got key. Got a medium amount of exp, capped several combat skills and skilled up my sword quite a bit, so it was ok. Sunday came and I asked for LB2 help again. got 2 replies, several were "sorry we are camping XXX right now..." the other was "sorry Lienna we jsut did that yesterday!"... and my second most favorite "you dont need ls for that.. jsut throw a party together and do it" wtf? whats the point of an LS?

So I say, ok fine, if no help with LB2 can anyone come help me get a key cause Im having horrible luck?, again the answer was basically no and I asked a few more times.. Then finally someone said yes, Indred...who ironically was also an SoB member...(thank you very much for the help) he gets out here and we start killing some mobs, no TH but kills were faster. Asking for help again spawned a rather worthless and beaten to-death topic of whether TH affects key drops. Gee how helpful, in the end another person offered his services (but only because he was able to get skillups on his sword or he would not have come) meh, thats not too surprising, but not too willing to help. But about 30 minutes pass, and the person had not changed zones. Err ok? asked a few times with no response, and another 20minutes pass and he finally answers saying he was sorry but had to help someone else... Nice that your helping, but thanks for not letting me know atleast?

Ironically a key dropped about 5 minutes after he came back.. so he wasnt needed anymore. Thanked Indred a few more times, apologized for his death (got him a Raise III with the help of Rabbai, thank you. so no real exp loss but it still sucked in general) and we go and grab the coffer, yay AF boots! About that time ls went to camp something in quicksand caves, I forget what but he asked if he could go so we parted ways and I went back to crafting since no LB for that day. I asked some more times that day for help the coming week with LB2, no one offered any. Ok now that was absurd, moving on...

Strike 23.2 Limit Break 2... on monday I figured, well lets see how well the forums work, so I posted a request for help with LB2.. one reply, Uchipu, thank you for wanting to help sorry you werent online when we went ^^. But that was it! Lets see then on wedensdy, I ask AGAIN for help with LB2 since now Im lvl 54 and close to cap and lots of people online and no NMs up, figured hey now ill get help! So I ask again... no reply at first.. then I get a few, but were they EK members? nope! they were SoB members. Only person that wasnt SoB was an EK person who needed LB2, sadly he didnt come cause no Vazhal crystal. But anyways it was all for me. I put together an alliance of about 8 people including myself. A few others couldnt make it (who were also from SoB cause they were helping someone else, or didnt have pearl equipped that I didnt know about) So we get going, do the mission, piece of cake, didnt take even an hour and a half it seemed. oh and no, SoB were not the only people on the ls. there were atleast T5 people on the ls who were in fact talking so not AFK. Oh and for an amusing note even HELLKID joined my party to help with LB2, someone who harrases the hell out of me on more than one ocassion and whome I had considerable mallace for for quite some time even helped me out. But no, not anyone from this great new ls we were supposed to have jsut joined..

So I ask this, if me being in this LS is a big help and so hard to find ninjas, wanting to help me with AF and quests and all that good stuff how is it so hard to take two hours out of your day to HELP said ninja with quests you were so anctious to do? hmm? is some NM that gives you a neat title more important than the so-called ninja who was really hard to find and a great asset to the ls? No, this is not some ego trip trying to feel important, this is about pointing out the bullsh*t.. which is starting to become quite a large pile...moving on...

Strike 37.8 the unprovoked blamming of an SoB member for the breaking of another persons pearl. Gee, when in doubt blame the new guy eh? wtf was that? Then with the followed freak out with the pearl sacks and so on...moving on...

Strike 96.1 following that uproar came some joking around by a few ls members who most of them are is not important..except for one. shaftstop, His joke was met with the most sickening reply Ive seen in a while, the comment was the result of a statement about shaftstop's subjob being really low. Which is expected to come into the light sometime, tho WHM is really going to be his sub under BRD. But his joke was, its not as bad as makoholics, 73rdm/7blm.. everyone laughed cause it was funny and very true. Then came the PM. Makoholic sent a PM to shaft, and I quote "Know ur place"... ok now what in the @#%^ is that? Shaft then replied saying "oh, sorry you got so offended" then mako said "im not offended" oh ya and I have a @#%^ing deskchair growing out my ***.. non-offended people dont pull some high and mighty, and over-reactive, bullsh*t to another person, especially an ls member. So that was wonderful, Ryu, today the subject came up about respecting each other in the ls, perhaps you should look to your own 'flock' a bit there? I frankly dont give a rats *** who has what rank in the ls, but if people are going to do sh*t like that then I wonder what definition of respect you are using. Since I have NONE for a person like that....ok moving on..

Strike 157.000 And that came today not 10 minutes before my urge to right this (which helped to increase the urge) The discussion came around to how come SoB members were getting kicked a lot and where everyone was. Then it came... another wonderful show of respect. As we were refering to SlumsOfBabylon as SoB its understandable that not everyone knew what we were talking about. However, Merlyn made a nice comment "Sons of ************** myself and a few others corrected, "no, SlumsOfBabylon" and the follow-up was "Oh, I was close". Hmm ok now for my first personal attack in this entire post.. Merlyn, go @#%^ yourself. Thanks. Wow such irony for something like that to occour DURING a discussion started by YOUR LS leader, Ryu, about having respect...real @#%^ing nice.

So in closing as a summary in case some of you lack the attention span to read my whole post , which you should do, since its rather important that someone knows there is a big @#%^ING PROBLEM HERE... but what Im trying to say here is that we were invited into this ls with open arms and great anticipation. To be followed with the kicking of ~1/3 of us, and another 1/3 leaving because of everyones bullsh*t. to leave the last 1/3rd here to be harrassed, abused, ignored and looked down upon from everyone else in the ls, an ls that was so happy to have lots of members so they could be ready for gods and dynamis, other HNM and so on. But simply left most people on thier own and not helping other members get to the status needed to fulfil this dream of becoming a true HNM ls... so Ill finsih this with.

Thank you for inviting us (me) into the ls with lies of wanting to get all these things done and work hard for a strong LS. Bullsh*t about how you really wanted to help me out. Thank you for inviting all of us to start, and kicking us all to end it. Thank you for the abuse and rudeness and *gasp* lack of respect. Thank you for a sh*tty experience in this rather sad ls....I had more respect for hellkid int he babylon days than I do now for some of you... Ryu, I still have respect for you, tho sorry I just hate your ls and your rules and the way things are handled. -Goodbye

-Lienna, the Sly.
55NIN, 30MNK, 28WAR, 23WHM, 17BLM, 11THF, 9SMN, 8RNG, 7SAM, 5BRD, 5RDM, 3BST.
88 Clothcraft, 60 Cooking, 60 Leathercraft, 45 Goldsmithing, 25 Smithing, 18 Alchemy, 8 Woodworking, 8 Fishing, 4 Bonecraft.


So to conclude, all be VERY aware of the ls EternalKnights, you have been warned not to accept a pearl from them. I feel sorry for you if you do.

*edit* well so far its been read atleast twice haha.. making good progress here...

Edited, Sat Dec 11 01:29:36 2004 by Lienna

there are atleast 5 lvl 75s that I know of from EK, and another 3-4 that came over when the ls's merged. Also there are atleast 3 more 70+ that I know of and a ton 65+ (most of the ls was 65-70). Never did ZM4, dont care too much anymore. Ya, youd think an HNM ls would be helpful but not this one.. they cared more about camping various NMs for the title or drop than anything else.. And on my parting (a few hours ago) I was called ignorant and "unable to handle it" because I told them what they really were...Oh well, hopefully more people will see this to know the truth and be aware of things such as this.

that post was very disturbing. O.O seems like ryu isnt the helper she claims to be. I guess being a HNM Ls or whatever changes people...

Edited, Tue Dec 14 09:25:35 2004 by Meara

In your first post, you noted Uchipu volunteered to help. You say here no one offered help. I would have gladly helped you with LB2 as well. I was at work when you posted the request. You had the mission complete before either Uchipu or I logged on.

There are people who have waited days and weeks for LB and AF help. You got these things as you needed them, which would make many players very happy. In your eyes, it doesn't matter because it was former SOB members who provided that help. I'm sorry you felt nobody was there for you, but your point is moot.

(As a side note, if anyone needs help with LB2 or something else, send Scar a /tell. If I'm not in an experience party or otherwise occupied, I will be more than happy to help. I'm currently a lvl 60 Paladin.)

<---is a member of the Eternal Knights and proud of it. Right when I joined the LS, Ryunoire was very nice to me and still is. I guess you had a bad experience with the LS but don't expect ryu to do everything for you. She has dynamis, sky, and a lot more things to and she still trys to help when she has some free time. When I was gonna get my Leg AF(RDM), she offered to help me get my hat too. Now that I hit 58, she said she'd help me and some more people on their AFs and I know she'll help me when shes free. This is a post to show that ryunoire is one of the best people I've met in FFXI.

Just because someone doesnt help when you want it doesnt mean they dont help heck Ive asked Ryu for help with stuff and dont get it until about a week later... but wait a minute i thought she wasnt helpful? Oh nvm you're right Im just dellusional and what really happened is i walked into Garlaige Citadel by myself at lvl 50 and soloed my AF3... I just asked ask for 7-1 help a few hours before making this post seeing as its in Ro Maeve and theyre on teh way to the Sky thus having to go through there to get there anyway but she says she'll help later (which my definition of later is later oin the same day) But me knowing shes a busy woman would be a fool to hold her too it but seeing as she said shed help I can guarantee you I'd have 7-1 done before the next 7 days are up and she would be the one who has helped.....


But Lieanna I guess patience isnt your strongest quality seeing as youre a nin (which hopefully subs war thus can tank and get invites asap thus not used to waiting while Im a thf and id be lucky if i got a pt within 12 hours let alone 12 weeks so i guess Ive had time to master the art of waiting while from what I gather (please correct me if Im wrong) your used to getting what you want the second you snap your fingers. Then when i got Sam in AF range this "extremely non helpful ls" helped with that.... or nvm i forgot that ls isnt helpful so Im guessing some godo samiritians hacked their ccounts and helped me while i was under the guise that those were teh actualy members from EK playing their accounst at the time... and i can guarantee you i didnt pay for AF help from some random person in Jueno because I'll be damned if i pay somone even 1 gil to help me with something they know damned well they needed help with themselves.

One more things to add about Ryu and her LSes unhelpfullness she took 3-4 hours out of her time plus got 15 other people to do the same thing to help ONE person get a 7 million gil sword for HIMSELF without ANYONE else including herself get anything in return for doing so... now if thats being unhelpful then maybe i need to take my a@$ back to school because i obviously failed or was sleep during the part where i was taught the defination of that word.

On a final note about her ignoring you i know myself shes busy and gets spemmed with tells constantly thus all the time she was "ignoring" you maybe youre tell got caught in teh sea of spam and she missed it.. because i for one know not once but on multiple occassions id have to send her the same tell about 10 times before she catches it and responds. That plus she has too many peole in that LS that needs stuff and everyone in it lives in everytime zone known yo man so theers no way youre gonan accomodate everyone but Im sure she wouldve got to helping you eventually. Im sure she wasnt gonan let you stay at 55 and be AFless for the rest of your FFXI life after all i do remember someone mentioning priorites... you try putting yourself in her shoes and tell us how youd be able to get to everybody that wanted something when they asked plus get whatever business you have to get to get done done.


As for the absurd rules... i actually find those rules to be fine compared to the other HNMlses out there hah you think her rules are bad? Then you might wanna stay 300 yards away from Hankun or anyone in his LS as far as rules go.. because when it comes to rules unles sthings have changed since he posted the joining requirements at VN boards a while back... id rather be put in military school and boot camp than to join that ls as far as rules go. and no that wasnt a DL flame thats was just a point proving that ryu's "absurd rules" are waayy more laid back compared to other LSes out there.

The members of the Eternal Knights do know how the LS was made so don't state anything thats false.

----------------------------------------------

This'll probaly be my last post in this topic so I'll say something, The Eternal Knights do help alot. You haven't been in that LS long enough to say that we don't help. We do help.


The Eternal Knights isn't a crappy LS...you don't like it...fine but don't expect to get everything so fast. Theres times when we're all busy.

Edited, Sat Dec 11 22:14:17 2004 by GilgShiva

Wow.

I didn't know all this was going on. I'm sorry I couldn't help more Lienna. As stated, there are TONs of people in the shell at any given moment, and when all the chatter starts, and if I'm EXPing, I usually take the pearl off.

Well here's my two cents...from a newish LS member...

I joined EK maybe about a month ago, when Ryunoire helped me, then a complete stranger, and a lowly WHM 62 with no AF gloves (I had given up on gloves, cuz I thought I'd just get Noble's in 5 levels). Her and Makoholic not only got the Beadeaux key for me, but also located the chest, and killed Dark Spark. All in one night that I joined. So to me, they were very helpful.

Yet I know that when a shell is that big, one can get lost in the crowd unfortunately. I felt similar feeling you had of 'being ignored' for the first 2-3 weeks that I hung out in the shell. I felt unimportant, I felt that the shell was rather 'clicky' a la High School, and being much older than most of the existing members, I had a feeling that perhaps this wasn't a shell for me. The worse feeling is when I logged in say {Good Evening} that no one even bothered to say "hi" back. When I tried to make a conversation, no one seemed to care.

But as I did more events, as I said silly comments here and there, I slowly made friends. Now when I say {Good Evening} I even get a few "<3 uchi!" back. Which is always a nice feeling. Sure there are a few (which I won't name) that I can't quite get along nor do I care to be friends with in the shell, but that's just like life. I do, however, still at times, feel like an outsider, since I am not a "tymer" member. Somehow I am not as important...I guess, just like when you join a new company, a new school, a new neighborhood, you just have to stick around, and wait for the relationship to develop.

Having said all this, I completely understand your frustration. I also think that it's unfair to call you inpaitent. An inpaitent person cannot have multiple crafts in their 60s, and Clothescraft almost at 90. (Heck! I'm at Clothescraft 25 and it infuriates me everytime I sit down to make the stupid fly lure!) You joined EK looking for help, looking for people that can support your job - yet - you didn't see the results you were promised. It seems that you experienced more than that too. So I respect your decision.

I cannot judge you nor anyone in the EK, as I don't know the whole story. I am also not familiar with the whole Babylon thing. (cluelss when it comes to the state of Vandy LSs) Not to mention the fact that I'm new myself.

I just feel that it's very unfortunate and I feel sorry that you had to feel the way you did. No one likes being frustrated, ignored, or insulted. Intended or not.

As I said on the website...I'm a weak little WHM. There is only so much I can do when it comes to killing things ; ; (I can sneak/invis people real good, and that's about it...o and Raise II) But if you need help with your AFs, do send me a /tell. I go for hours LFGing on weekdays.

This is my final post in this thread, for the reason that the people who posted supporting EK do the SAME thing EK did. You focus on ONE thing and sweep the rest under the rug. You simply picked my statement about Ryu and ran with it. making no comments on the other stuff. At the end of the post I stated that I did not have any problem with Ryu herself. I let the part where she "didnt see" my questions go, that was no big deal at all. But since everyone I guess had no answer for the rest of it, they just ignored it. It seems to be getting a bit more common on these forums, some sort of disease called Selective Literacy, which apparently is leaking from the game itself. But I dont really care anymore, my post got through to enough people. Just its sad that people in EK dont even see this to be a problem, not even a little.

But to sumarize. The real problems since people either chose not to read them or simply did not think when they were doing so

1. Its not that Ryu was always busy or people would not help. It is that EK itself did not help. Even when they were not doing anything, Yes Im aware of dynamis on the weekends (one main reason why I started lvling again). Yes Im aware of the website which members should be checking a lot. Thats why I posted for help. I also asked for a week and a half in ls for help witht he replies of "no" not no replies at all.

2. Im used to doing things on my own, even when Im in an ls. The largest problem here was the rudeness, not the lack of willingness to help and especially not on the part of Ryu, after all an ls leader has a ton of things to do, as well as having Dynamis and all that other stuff. I was also never made aware of the "Dont message Ryu as she proly wont see your tell" thing. So thats that

3. Again its the rudeness and over all really nasty attitude and lack of respect several of the members have for people, especially new members. I will say that Makoholic, you apologized and I thank you. And that you were the only one, if only a few more people could be more like you (as scary as that may sound lol) it might be a good start for the ls.

And that is all I have to say about that... -Lienna

*edit*

This reply was one of the best replies, thank you Scar for understanding what Ive been trying to say.. -Lienna





hmm sorry, I didnt mean to take outright verbal bashing too personally and yes I did post on the site, cant tell now though because all posts by a person are instantly deleted when a user account is removed. Apparently an issue that Scar is working on.

Edited, Tue Dec 14 17:45:37 2004 by Lienna

lienna if you need ny help send me a /tell i can get you help fairly quickly ^.^.

I printed this entire thread out and read it through over the course of three smoke breaks at work. Wow.

First off, I think the way that it was made to look like this was a rant against Ryunoire through the replies is a perfect example of how the meaning and intent of a post can be completely changed by the replies. Lienna was upset with EK as a whole. The replies turned it into "Lienna is upset with Ryunoire." Can we stop this?

Now for the meat. My best in-game friend is in EK, and, much to my chagrin, he doesn't want to leave. Why is this a bad thing? Because recently, with no reason given (at first) as to why, I was kicked from EK.

Before I continue, let me state that I really don't have a problem with asking for help and not getting it. You get that in all major linkshells, many of which I have been a part of at one time or another. I will say that, while I have accepted that it is (sadly) just the way things are, the whole thing with no one answering when help is requested, even with a simple "no", infuriates me to no end. The only reasoning I can come up with for this is that those being solicited to for help are afraid whoever is asking will hate them, so they act like they didn't see it. Sure, some of them may actually not have seen it, but in linkshells of 40+ people (which are where the experiences I'm drawing on in writing this have taken place), to quote William Shakespeare, "There aint no f*ckin' way."

But I digress. When I was kicked from EK, Ryu was not on-line. I was almost sure this was some sort of misunderstanding, as I had always had great respect for her and enjoyed our friendship. When she got on a few days later, I asked her what had happened. She informed me that an EK member had seen me in Jeuno with my main linkshell, HeroofCarpeDiem (HoCD) equipped. Ryu then told me that the rule now was that EK members were only allowed to have pearls from other linkshells equipped when in their mog house, and that was why I was kicked.

There are so many things wrong with this I don't even know where to start. I told Ryu that I thought it was ridiculous, and she told me that since she had put this rule in effect, she had not had any competition camping any HNMs from the other "big" linkshells. This may be, but what is to keep someone from running to their mog house and equipping another linkshell if they intend to leak ToDs? Let me restate that my best in-game friend is in EK, and I told Ryu this. I'm sorry, but I just don't see how HNMs take priority over the relationships we've built over the many months we've all played. I'm sure others have similar stories.

Ryu, if you're reading this, please stop this ****-esque ridiculousness. You cannot keep people from leaking ToDs with gestapo tactics, but I will tell you what you can do it with. Trust. Friendship. Camaradery. All the things that seem to be erased when a linkshell decides to start hunting HNMs.

I honestly just don't get it.