Rolling on Greens - EnchantingFollow

Usualy I feel better when i read a story about some greedy player getting mad that someone else is greedy.

Realy Pot, I would like to intruduce you to the Kettel.

I am a enchanter, and I play well with others, if a group passes on a item, i take it, and we roll again on the Reagents, everybody nedds them, not just you. You said you had talked about looting, well then boot em, while I think you are just as greedy by thinking a enchanter "Needs" any item for DE is just as worng. You see Disenchanting a item is most deffenetly GREED, and theirfore you are just as bad as the guy that wants to outfit their alt.

Bottom line, Disenchanting items is a Greed roll and saying otherwise is lying to yourself and others, their is nothing wong if nobody else Needs the item and you want to roll on it, dont be suppried that someone else is greedy too.

Just because your an enchanter doesnt mean you get all greens. Everyone else still needs money, which is part of the reason people do instances. Loot rules still apply as normal. If the item is needed by another player, let them have it. If it is needed by no one, then it is a 'V roll' and everyone gets to roll. Just because your an enchanter, doesnt mean you get special privlages.

Gah! even at lvl 45 I'm still such a noob.
I swear, it's nothing ;D Live and learn. (or play and learn)

The N for need seems to be universal but a lot of people use V for Vendor and G for Greed interchangably. Personally I prefer G as the established terms are Need/Greed.

Maybe that person rolling on everything was just used to the higher level raids. In those, every single green BoE item is rolled on by everyone without a second thought. We don't look at the stats, the type or anything ; if it's green, we roll on it. If an enchanter says he wants every greens no one can use for disenchanting, he'll pretty much be told to shut up and leave if he doesn't like it. Everyone needs gold, and we can sell that loot for gold even if we're not enchanters. Even the blue BoP that everyone pass on don't to go enchanters ; they're randomed and someone disenchants it for the winner. To me, the greedy one in that post is the enchanter, not the person that was rolling on everything, and for the record, I'm a 300 enchanter myself (check the link to Kyrie if you don't believe it).

the best way to look at it is this:

if the item is BoP, EVERYONE passes unless they are going to equip it themselves. if everyone ends up passing, those who wish to vendor or DE the item can roll for it manually (/roll).

if the item is NOT BoP, there are two ways of dealing with it, and this should be predetermined by the group:

1) if an item is an upgrade, it is given to whomever needs it. for every BoE item, members choose N for need or G for greed. unless you are GOING to use the item AS ARMOR/WEAPON, it is labelled greed.

2) all people roll on all BoE items equally. this is more common is higher-level instances (from what ive been seeing) as the worth of the items increases.

Sadly, this is a rare occasion. If you're with guildmates - YES, the do offer FREE enchants, not just ordinary enchants, but the best enchants they could offer.

But parties made of different guilds? Very rare. for everyone disbands right after they complete the instance, to turn in quests, to sell loots, or proceed to their next quests.

To my experience, It seems to start with BRD and DM. At this point, green items are generally much less sought-after as blue drops get more and more common. Also, a good part of your gear should already be rare items, and few green drops can compare so they're freely rolled on.

NGB isn't irrelevant at any level ; in fact, it's even more relevant at higher levels where people are less forgiving and mistakes aren't very tolerated. Even if it's an accident, rolling on a BoP rare or epic you can't use will most likely get you dropped from a pick-up group. For those items, most pick-up groups seem to follow the rule that everyone passes on it, and if some people want to take it as an upgrade, they'll random for it. If no one wants it, it's then greeded. Seeing as another common rule is that you may only get one upgrade per run, sometimes you have to take a gamble and pass on an item you could really use for a chance to get an even better one. Of course, you can always pass, then offer to buy the item (assuming it's BoP) from the winner for the same price he'd sell a large brilliant shard.

i like the following method which only a few groups i've been in have used, mainly players who have higher-level alts already. Roll on everything green! Greed! Blue and BoP will be determined by Need first, then greed. This is by far the best choice imo..i won't care if i lost a green item i can actually use because i had a chance to roll on other greens which i sell for money, and then maybe i can buy something else. up to the level 50s, a lot of green gear for my druid is only 1-2g...seriously how much of a dent is that? when i can get even 5 green items to sell for 5-10g total, and have to dish out 2g for a piece i like from the AH, i'm happy. now i dont know about green mail and plate, but leather and cloth are pretty cheap up to 50 or so.

the next best choice is, everyone roll on green unless some calls Need. but that doesn't often work well..suddenly every green item is needed so the other 4 players have to pass. my worst experience with this was a mage who was an enchanter. everyone did as expected for the first few rolls, it went very nice. suddenly there was a nice leather headpiece i could wear as an upgrade to my current piece right away so I "need" this, but everyone rolled on it. the mage won it, and was so happy about being able to DE it. i asked for it again, he still said he was going to keep it to DE it. that definitely made me upset. it was almost like, as we progressed deeper into the instance, the previous rules were being forgotten as we all got comfortable pulling, killing, rolling, moving along.

now the worst case of rolling is probably this one: "Can I roll on it bc I have an alt who can use it even though my current char can't?". N-O. NO! If your alt can use it, your alt should be here.

i also hate the players who roll on BoP items when someone in the group can use it. their reason? "i can sell it for 50 silver". damn, are you that freaking poor that 50s means a lot to you, more than the player who just lost a really good item he could use?

my final tip: idiot players advance because we allow them to advance. in WoW they can solo thru more but they still have a reputation to maintain. if someone acts like an idiot, boot them from the group. i'd rather not finish a quest or instance than to suffer thru some idiot player's antics. this especially includes looting antics.


Edited, Wed Jun 15 12:41:23 2005 by bluegayle

I'm surely also a lvl 27 noob :) What do you mean by this "take it as an upgrade"?

"I guess it is kind of selfish on my part to want all the greens to further my enchanting skills, but its really frustrating. "

It is selfish, other people have tradeskills and items to acquire also, this can be done by selling those greens. Everyone should roll on any BoE in a pickup group unless loot rules beforehand counter that. If you want to raise enchanting group with friends only and/or buy greens on the AH.

It's frustrating for other people to pass on gold because enchanters want to skill up.

Random unused BoEs and spread the wealth around. Your 2 friends in that group were already giving you the major chance to get the items anyway over any single person.

Here is another idea for getting reagents for an enchanter that i have used to good effect. I have a paladin lvl 41, who is a miner / smith, and i use the bars to make simple, cheap items that i then mail to my enchanter to DE. One very easy pattern is Rough Bronze Leggings, which take only 6 bronze bars to make, no gems, thread, grinding stones or anything else. These usually DE to Strange Dust (and plenty of it, usually 3 to 6 dust each). As i have gone higher i note other patterns that are easy to make, like Patterned Bronze Bracers (5 bronze bars and 2 course grind stones). A high level alt with tailoring, smithing, leatherworking, or engineering can usually make good amounts of items for DE for someone's enchanter, and this can be far faster and easier than farming for items except for very high level items. My paladin is at 250 smithing, and quite a few of the mithril items that need lvl 40+ to wear require only 12 to 16 mithril bars to make, and maybe a few grindstones. Happy crafting!

P.S.

The higher the level of the item you DE the better the reagents usually are, and weapons seem to give more essences, armor seems to give more dusts.

Edited, Wed Jul 20 12:20:41 2005 by Crashdyv

I suggest only doing the instances with guildmates you can trust (which should be all of them) and get your guild in Ventrilo. That way there is no confussion, you can talk about each drop.

Also, I am sure you have a guildmate who is a leatherworker/skinner? Have him make you stuff to disenchant. I do that for our guild enchanter. I have given him probably hundreds of gold in items not to mention the mats and vendor resources needed to make the items.

Of course our guild came over from UO and we have been playing together for well over 5 years already so that helps.

Bugeater of Laughing Skull